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Conceptual "Fluid" Storyline (RPG)


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#1 ParaplegicPenguin

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 04:23 AM

Hey everyone. I'm in the midst of working on a fairly big project of mine. I've actually been working on this off and on for a few years and the concept has grown into quite the undertaking

I suppose I'm writing this out to see what people think. I'd rather know that at least some people would be interested in playing a game like this before I actually go out and slave away turning this thing into a reality.

The game is a hybrid between a retro-styled rpg and a medieval sim. The main concept behind it is that everything about it, including the main story itself, is randomly generated each time you play. Not at start-up, however, but gradually morphing into whatever the story it is to become through the use of random events and player interaction. This is how the engine works after the land is generated:

First, Much like an rts, a random number of races are created and a mustering_hall for each one is randomly placed within the main room.

Each mustering_hall acts as a main building for each kingdom. They have a king and it is also the gathering point for villagers with nothing to do. Speaking of villagers:

Villager's are very important to the game's engine. Without them, kingdom's would never develop and the main story would never progress. An interesting feature (that I've already implemented on a tiny scale) is that each villager has stats ie (atk, range, magic, good/evil, vit, etc) They also have individual needs. Needs need to be met otherwise the villagers will die. No need for alarm though for villagers take care of themselves mostly. To sum that up, Its through the villager's needs and them taking care of themselves that kingdoms are developed and due to random events that occur, villager needs are always changing.

This happens as follows: Say the season in the game is winter. The villagers are freezing to death and, in a state of panic, the king/lord/whatever of the kingdom decides that they need a fire to stay warm. The king then sends out a villager who then goes out and posts this "need" as a contract in the contract office. Another villager would then go to the office and build a camp fire. Its through either the player or the npc's themselves completing contracts that kingdoms develop. These contracts act as generic quests. I like this concept because it allows for easy quest generation. And, there will of course be other sorts of quests ie talking to people, finding ana item, etc. But as far as kingdom development, all can be found at the contract office. (I'll eventually come up with a more medieval name :P)

There's more to it-
completing contracts = kingdom development, sure, but the player can choose which contracts he or she does. Contracts require certain skills so someone who's built up their character as an assassin taking out targets cannot complete the "Build court house" contract (unless they also have the prerequisite skills for that as well). This leads to the player being able to control the story a bit. It also lets them work towards a profession which hopefully adds more immersion to the game.
Moreover and to point, the main-story conforms to the gamer's playing style without losing direction. There's also something always taking place being that everything is in real-time.

Example of story-oriented quests:
On start up, you are placed in the wilderness with your map and need to survive. Your character is given a randomly generated quest by default which will take them to the nearest town. Once that quest is finished, the player will find themselves in the midst of an event. This event could be anything but to make things interesting, let's say interaction between kingdoms has already taken place. Diplomacy is in the works and you are the courier for a very important scroll. IF you succeed in your task, giving the scroll to the npc that it was intended for, then yay! quest complete and the two kingdoms are that much closer to becoming allies. Say you were to fail however. You lose the scroll, you die, you insult the targeted npc, ect. Something bad happens and the two kingdoms are at war with each other. Because king's have a primitive "motives ai" the game's engine would then build up a strategy for the king. With randomly set values -say, evil = 90%, likes to lie = 100%, etc. He chooses to hire a kidnapper to kidnap the princess of the other kingdom. That king would then of course send out a contract to save his daughter and only those brave enough would dare go out and try to save her. Note: If you were to accept this quest, keep in mind that at the same time that you're trying to save her, the other king is trying to keep her and, with the use of contracts, the villagers of the other kingdom begin to build defenses. The difficulty of the quest can also be determined by your standing with the kingdom which has the princess. If no one really knows you that well, sneaking in and grabbing her wouldn't necessarily be an easy feat but still much easier than if all occupants of that kingdom were on high alert searching for you because you've messed wit them before.

That quest is a bit advanced and for the better half of it still all theory-based but I'm fairly sure its doable, however tedious and an epic undertaking it may be.

Anyway, that's how the game's going to work.

What do people think of this sort of concept?

Feel free to post any feedback whatsoever
thanks!
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#2 Markonicus

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 06:03 AM

This sound very interesting. I love the setting and the fact that it's not just the character, but the world as a whole develops as time goes on and quests are completed. I don't know how far you've gone with the development, but if you complete it count on me to play it. Or if you need testers at one point.
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#3 ND4SPD

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 09:08 AM

Of course, this sounds fantastic. Noone has ever said "I'd really like to play a game where I have no choices to make. The story is linear, the levels are linear. In fact, I don't even want to reach a fork in the road on a level. I just want to run straight forward. Actually, make the entire game a quick time event." (Got a bit carried away there :P). But I, and many others, want a game that is randomly generated, varies every time you play, gives the playdom freedom to do nearly anything and take nearly any approach to a mission.

HOWEVER. Have you thought of how you'd actually implement this? How fast it would be to populate an entire world with NPCs that have their own stats and needs and wants? Is this at all feasible?

Edited by ND4SPD, 03 June 2012 - 09:09 AM.

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#4 chance

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 10:02 AM

You talked about the quest(s) of one villager from one kingdom. What role do the other (random number of) kingdoms play?

Either way, sounds like you've thought this out fairly thoroughly. The storyline, game design and objective are pretty clear (unlike most topics we see here). But like ND4 said, this is a massive undertaking. Have you made smaller scale RPGs before, or is this your first one?
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#5 ParaplegicPenguin

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 08:33 PM

Hey thanks for the replies guys!

I'll try and answer both of your questions

@ND4SPD

The npc's will probably be one of the easiest 'pieces' of the game to code and I'm not too worried about them. They really aren't that intelligent. They're given a goal/need and they do whatever they can to fill that goal/need. There's just going to be so many goals/needs that they'll seem to be living, intelligent beings. The npc itself doesn't decide which goal/need to accomplish first either. Each goal is give a priority level ranging from 1-100. All the npc has to do is check which need/want has the highest priority. So yes, I see it as feasible for they really aren't that intelligent once you remove their smoke and mirrors :P

As for how long it would take for the world to be populated with npc's, fairly long actually. In fact, hours upon hours of gameplay. Expect to be a full-fledged baddass by the time that happens. Something which I forgot to mention in my original post regarding npc's:

Npc's create npc's. Now, I'm not sure I'll go above and beyond and create "simulated love" but I do plan on having two npc's finding each other after the "make_child_npc" variable is set to true, going into the house that the male npc owns, and then eventually have the two parents plus a small child pop back out and get back to work. Npc's start out as infants and I'm thinking their aging cycle will be completely based off of the game's simulated weather/time engine.

Those two engines are also fairly easy to create. I'm considering having each day/night cycle be fifteen minutes. From there, a week is a week just as much as a month is a month and a year is a year. After that, there will also be the weather system which is that cycle divided by four. The weather engine also plays an important role in the game's entirety because they help fuel a small fraction of the random events engine.

Example: Say its summer and a fire breaks out. Forests will burn along with whatever else is around them. I've already created a "semi-realistic-in-functionality" fire spread system which requires fuel to burn. If it has a fuel source, nothing will stop the fire from spreading to other flammable objects near by (including npc's and their respectable kingdoms) Another interesting twist is that this, too, can be tied into the quest engine.

Example:
1-Start fire near village
2a-Watch kingdom burn to ashes(this would give the other kingdoms an advantage)
2b-Put out fire(Popularity in that kingdom would improve. In fact, you'd be a hero!) ..Just dont get caught setting fires haha
3-Profit

Any more questions/did I answer your original?
-Happy to answer




@chance

That's actually a very good question. It all depends on one decision I'm yet to make. Should I make it fantasy-based or make it historically accurate?
I'm considering both for the following two reasons:
1-Fantasy games offer more diversity in just about anything ranging from the entire race of a kingdom, to the way each race interacts with another (racism may be a thing if I choose to add it)
2-Historically based would limit the player to only that which an average human could accomplish. (there would still be spell casting and magic however to keep things interesting) A plus side however would be that I would have a much easier time drawing all of the sprites being that otherwise, each race would have to look drastically different and that's very time consuming. I guess it all depends on how lazy I am or if I can find a decent enough artist to draw the sprites for me -hint hint

Either way, whichever I do end up choosing, you were asking about kingdoms and the roles that they play. That, too, is random. Each kingdom has a leader and that leader has a "primitive motives ai" or so ive been calling it. It's within that leader's ai that the role of the kingdom is based upon. Say leader4, when created, has a certain desire/motive. That kingdom's role would reflect that of the leader's actions.
So yes, their will be roles and motives for each kingdom. The roles are influenced by both the leader's motives and the player's interaction.

Also to note though previously mentioned:
Npc's have jobs. The role they play would be whatever occupation they have. However, nothing's to stop the random events engine from turning a normal npc into someone who drastically changes the direction of the game.

And yes, I've made a few smaller RPG's in the past but nothing compared to this. What I've been doing for the last few weeks or so however is create each "piece" of the game's engine in a completely different project. Once I get each piece of the engine working properly, I'll compile everything, slowly building the game from the ground up. Seems like the most logical way to go about things. There's so much for me to do (not to mention that I'm working alone) I fear I may wind up lost in code somewhere.

Any more questions/did I answer your original?
-Happy to answer

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#6 Lune

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 11:46 PM

Noone has ever said "I'd really like to play a game where I have no choices to make. The story is linear, the levels are linear. In fact, I don't even want to reach a fork in the road on a level. I just want to run straight forward. Actually, make the entire game a quick time event."

Not to that extreme, no, but there is something to be said about linearity. Keeping control in the designer's hand allows for a certain larger level of specificity, where details are more crisp and intentional. Attributes have more balance and composition in their variety when hand-crafted.

Note that I don't think this is an inherently bad idea! It simply needs a lot of skill to be handled right. So the variation produced by the game can't feel superficial, like a race of blue people and a race of green people. It has to have an impact on game play. Differences between kingdoms and races should give rise to different kinds of challenges. For instance, a kingdom in the ice land should be either invulnerable to fire attacks (too cold for things to stay burning) or incredibly susceptible (fire isn't something they ever naturally have to deal with, so nothing is built fireproof). It's going to have to be a case of the dev team thinks of everything, too, or the game will feel artificially limited.

Basically, just keep in mind the kind of scope you're positing. I'd rather play one tight, well-crafted experience than ten mediocre, generic ones. So here's the challenge: make the differences significant, and make everything fun. Good luck! :thumbsup:
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#7 ParaplegicPenguin

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Posted 04 June 2012 - 03:25 AM

Haha, yes this is very true and I'm going to have to be very cautious when going about this. However, fear not because it wont be as mundane as blue vs green colored races haha :) Hidden within the game's engine are a multitude of significant events that can be called out randomly. In other words, some events can be triggered in many, many different ways. These events, when triggered, will be significant because they cannot be easily un-done. Its the one part of the game's engine that's nearly set completely in sone (the only part not in stone being the chance that it doesnt happen) -they may not be triggered at all depending on whether or not that particular random, significant event was called/initialized during start-up when the game's engine creates everything. As a benchmark, I'd like to have at least four-hundred of these events, each being very diverse than the others. They'll take time to create but hey, I like writing/story telling so it shouldn't be too hard, just tedious -as will be most of this project.

And you bring up a very good point regarding the kingdom's location and the particular race that they are -and what advantages/disadvantages they have depending on those two circumstances. It's a goal of mine to give kingdoms/races just as much diversity as the npc's that inhabit them. The greatest part is that there will be a far greater number of kingdoms and enough random diversity within each kingdom than the amount of kingdoms that are actually created. In other words, even if the same kingdom is created during a second play through, it too will still be slightly altered than before

Edited by ParaplegicPenguin, 04 June 2012 - 03:25 AM.

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#8 biguglyguy

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Posted 04 June 2012 - 05:23 AM

Note that I don't think this is an inherently bad idea! It simply needs a lot of skill to be handled right. So the variation produced by the game can't feel superficial, like a race of blue people and a race of green people. It has to have an impact on game play. Differences between kingdoms and races should give rise to different kinds of challenges. For instance, a kingdom in the ice land should be either invulnerable to fire attacks (too cold for things to stay burning) or incredibly susceptible (fire isn't something they ever naturally have to deal with, so nothing is built fireproof). It's going to have to be a case of the dev team thinks of everything, too, or the game will feel artificially limited.

Don't worry, he has a 3rd year video game programming and design student with 6 years of experience making games (not so much with GameMaker though) helping him out. I'm am definitively not saying I am by any means "skilled" but I do have quite a bit of gaming theory knowledge under my belt. However, I do agree that this could turn our really bad if it is not handled just right. We are actually planning on sitting down and writing out a full design doc sometime soon to hopeful get rid of most of the design issues right from the beginning.
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#9 Lune

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Posted 04 June 2012 - 09:14 PM

I'm glad to hear it, guys! Good luck with this.
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#10 {UM} GHILLI

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Posted 12 June 2012 - 12:30 AM

This sounds awesome! I would definitely be interested in playing something like this.

I'm guessing this will be a 2D game?
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#11 Desttinghim

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Posted 12 June 2012 - 12:46 AM

This is the type of game I'd like to play or make. This is an idea that really needs more attention. I may be able to help out with graphics, but only occasionally. Well, anyway, good luck! You'll probably need some :P
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#12 gmx0

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Posted 13 June 2012 - 04:18 PM

Actually, make the entire game a quick time event." (Got a bit carried away there :P).

I did that once, and people actually played it! O_____________________________o (there's also movies....)

Anyway, the premise sounds awesome! My only concern is that the simulation may be potentially slow, but Im sure that can be resolved.

But make sure its not all "collect-this" type of quests.
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#13 ParaplegicPenguin

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Posted 15 June 2012 - 04:32 PM

@Ghilli -Yes it is
@Desttinghim -Thank you, Ill need all the luck I can get
@gmx0 -Don't worry. Quest generation will be as diverse as you can imagine. This is so because each quest generated bases itself off of random qualities given to either a person, an item, or an event during their creation. Its with these randomly given qualities/properties that the quests get their uniqueness. I still need to do some more testing but as of now, I see it as safe to say that no quest should be created twice, though other quests may appear similar.
Posted Image

Above is a visual presentation of how quests are generated (other randomness generated the same way)

The quest starts out with the player needing to retrieve a staff.
- note that the staff wasn't created until the player accepted the quest -

When the staff is created, the game assigns random 'qualities' to it. These qualities are what lead/develop the quest's story.
This cycle is repeated whenever the quest generates more of itself.

With this technique, quests can remain completely random yet still have enough structure to be interesting/make sense

Some more things to note: Qualities given out to items, npc, and events can have interesting effects. For example, say the player declines or fails the quest. The npc who owns the staff will of course use it and because its a very powerful item, the player may wind up having to deal with that particular npc on a later date. This may happen if that npc triggers an event - say he tries to take control of a kingdom. The quest generator would create a quest based off of his actions. Even better, the player could then take the staff for themselves. (which would be awesome because its bound to be littered with souls at that point)

Edited by ParaplegicPenguin, 17 June 2012 - 04:34 PM.

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