143 replies to this topic

[NpN Games]

You can also limit some resources in LITE version like you can only add 3 rooms, 20 objects, or like that only...

[Davve]

25 guests are reading this topic lol...

A Game Maker logo in the top-left corner of one's screen when playing a lite game would be a good idea.

[gnysek]

So as I said before 5 or 10 minutes playable exes are good. First game of newbie user is sth like "catch the clown", so 5 minutes is even too much for it. But after he learn some GML, game will be longer, with better graphic, maybe some music - and here comes need for Standard version.

But... watermark or room with logo at beginning is also good idea. There can be even a text "This game was created in Game Maker / visit yoyogames.com for more info" under it - similar is in The Games Factory at end if I remember correctly. This will be better that current small image in corner when game is loading.

[Dangerous_Dave]

At risk of maybe some negative comments... but what about adding adverts into the Game Maker interface? So the developer sees ads while developing. Maybe something in the bottom left corner, or a panel across the bottom or right.

It's a way of making money from the people who will never upgrade.

Edit: I don't like the idea of time limited exes, and a yoyogames watermark/banner will no longer work.

I used GM for years before it started charging. I never donated when it was asked of me, and I didn't upgrade for a while after it went "pro". All in all, it was years of use, with some pretty long games, before I finally paid for it. I doubt that I would have paid for it at all without that. It's partly because of my age back then, but many GM users these days are around that age or younger.

As for the watermark, they can just upload their game to YoYoGames.com, then download a watermark free version.

Edited by Dangerous_Dave, 31 March 2011 - 09:10 AM.

[Jazza4Lyf]

After the game ends, you could display one final room with an advertisement saying the game was made with Game Maker Lite with a link to the YoYo site and another that closes the game. This way it doesn't disrupt gameplay but you still get your message across.

Or, when the game transitions to another room after a certain time, transition to an advertisement room instead with the same stuff as above but instead of closing the window goes to the proper room. This does inturrupt gameplay but as its a room transition, it's less likely to screw them up mid-game.

[LegacyCrono]

NpN Games, that'd be pretty much useless. I believe that it's a well-known fact that you could bypass such limitation.

Hmm... The watermark sounds good, but I can't see how it'd work, considering that the game window could be as small as 32x32, so it could be a problem.
I like the time limitation idea. As gnysek said, it could be used to drive people into buying the Standard version. But I think that it could be easily bypassed without much efforts.
Not allowing to change icon, splash, loading bar and window caption is a great idea, I think that people could live with that.

I think that a message when starting/closing the game would be okay. Something simple that would require to press an "OK button" to continue. Clicking a button to start the game would be rather annoying, but bearable, so I think it's a fine solution.

[Yal]

. There can be even a text "This game was created in Game Maker / visit yoyogames.com for more info" under it - similar is in The Games Factory at end if I remember correctly.

This is onto something - how about a 10 second splash screen or something that shows up when you end a Lite game by pressing escape, saying that "This game was created in Game Maker Lite, visit yoyogames.com for more info. (This screen can be switched off in the Standard and Professional edition of Game Maker)"


As for the TV-style logo, that's good too. To make people a bit more supportive, let there be an option in Preferences: in what corner would you like the logo to show up? This would likely make more people cope with it, since after all they'd get some means of customizing it to suit their game better (for instance, they could put the HUD where they want without worrying about the logo covering it).

Having loading/icon noncustomizable could also work pretty fine. In the GM6 days there was the "Made With Game Maker" window that popped up while the loading bar was loading. Having the actual loading bar image state that this was made with Game Maker Lite could also do the trick.

Or perhaps have EXE info fields (Under the name of an EXE, Description and Company shows up in grayscale when in Icon view) always default to "Game Maker Lite application", instead of being able to be any text the user desires?

[Derme]

At risk of maybe some negative comments... but what about adding adverts into the Game Maker interface? So the developer sees ads while developing. Maybe something in the bottom left corner, or a panel across the bottom or right.

It's a way of making money from the people who will never upgrade.

That's not a bad idea, you don't want the people playing games on the YYG website to have to suffer for the developer not buying Game Maker. This would be perfect, you can either use GM with adverts, limited abilities and the banner when the game is loading. Or you can buy GM and work on a "cleaner" surface. This wouldn't drive developers insane, but at the same time it would "encourage" them to but GM. The only problem with this would be an internet connection, you'd need to be online to see ads.

@Mike Removing the ability to build .EXE files from the lite version, would see us miss out on some very good games on the YYG website.

@gnysek Watermarks are also a good idea, when you watch TV with a watermark down the bottom (small), you know it's there, but it doesn't bother you.

@LegacyCrono Think about it, all those GM games you download from YYG, with the same boring sphere...

Alright simply, I don't think that any "Light" implementations should effect the end-user, and removing .exe completely would see a loss of many good newbie devs. So I think if you implement somthing that would effect the dev more than the player would be a better solution.

Edited by Derme, 31 March 2011 - 09:28 AM.

[Dangerous_Dave]

The only problem with this would be an internet connection, you'd need to be online to see ads.

That's true. You could always have some stock ads, included in the program. If you can't get an internet connection, show those. Links to YoYo, maybe a sponsor.

[Slowbro]

I think some kind of logo or watermark would be the way to go here. I think a timer would simply piss people off to the extent that they wouldn't want to try the program for a long enough period that they might consider purchasing it.

[MasterOfKings]

I know this sounds somewhat stupid (or impossible); but most of the Lite games that are looked down upon are Tutorial rip-offs.. I think it would be good to have a separate file format for tutorials. So, GM can open and read them, but can't run them or export them as ordinary .exes. Of course, it's defeated by just copying and pasting code; but would a newbie really be that dedicated?

If you throw up a watermark; you'll just end up with a heap of games on YYG (and elsewhere) with that watermark. It doesn't incline them to buy GM by that much.

Would it be possible to give the Lite version a slower runner? So, games performed are generally worse anyway. If someone wants to make a good game, they'll almost require purchasing.

We put a "Make with GameMaker" thing in a corner of the screen (let you pick)

I think "Made with Game Maker" would be better.

-MoK

Edited by MasterOfKings, 31 March 2011 - 09:54 AM.

[YellowAfterlife]

In my opinion, a proper watermark would do it. 3d GameStudio is using "watermark + splashscreen with engine logo" combination for a while already, and it works fine for them.
If "translated" to Game Maker, that would mean that user could specify watermark location in global game settings, and loading image would always stay as Game Maker logo with site adress.

Window size limitation sounds fair (though, I can see no reason for not letting user to create smaller rooms - view scaling may be used).
Displaying something in the end of the game would be bad, because that would slow down process of developement & learning the program, thus user will have higher chances to ragequit.
If game "Title" means window title, that is neutral - if there is a watermark in-game already, why would you want another adverstiment in game window? That feels strange.

To say, ZOOM + draw_self() do not seem to be worthy rewards for all future user's problems. Probably many will prefer using GM8.0Lite over new version.

P.S. NAL is not Nal, as he stated not once already.

Edit: What's up with a featured "forum" program on yoyogames homepage, by the way?

Edited by YellowAfterlife, 31 March 2011 - 10:27 AM.

[sabriath]

Too many posts, so I'll just say my opinion, if it matches someone else, sorry.


- cannot change the control icon, title text, or window size/scale
- the loading screen cannot be changed, only "Made in Game Maker" along with a "click here to make your own games!" button...a minimum 5 seconds required on the loading screen (it is reasonable, it's functional and kills 2 birds with 1 stone)
- watermark in top left corner of main window
- showing the info/F1/whatever screen will have "Made in Game Maker" along with a link to YYG website at the very top, followed by whatever the programmer puts


Having an on-exit Ad sucks, especially during debug testing. But since I think everyone should purchase the product, I agree with the no-exe approach...if people want free software, they can learn the hard languages. Plus, there's always GM 7 lite that you guys can keep active for those who want to "get the feel" for what GM is all about.

[oddbob0]

Mike, first up thanks for listening. It's seriously appreciated.

I think ads, also, would be more work for no return of note. At least not in any of the PC-centric formats we've got right now. I suspect that there's a point where they could be made to work but I also imagine you don't want to throw that time up the wall on a longshot.

The plan-at-the-moment though sounds super and easily adjustable if you need to increment/amend/work around for future revisions. Which I suspect may be a win all round.

[sabriath]

I still feel that there should be only 1 GM 8.1 version....standard...no lite. If people want to "try it out", then they can use GM 8.0 or 7.0 lite, keep those on the shelf. I don't see how making 2 versions of a new product is going to help YYG as a company...you want people to "experience" how making games is easy, you already have software that does that.

I also feel that you should get rid of 8.0/7.0 pro versions, and only have 1 type of upgrade, to standard. It's YYG product, it's a good product, act like it...sell it proper. The lite users will keep trying to take and take and take all they can for free. They'll follow new versions as they come out, YYG should stop feeding them, 8.0 should be the end of the line! No more should you put up with that crap, tell them "that's it, stay in 8.0 all you want but we draw the line here, now." You (Mike, Rus, and the rest) have worked far too hard to see these leaches give you no pennies, no food on the table!

Stand up! Be proud! Be a company!! Charge for standard and give no quarter for the pinchers!!!



edit: The other reason I feel this way is, if you get rid of or enforce rules upon the exe itself on a "lite" version while maintaining a "standard" one as well, you'll just open up a side business with people who are willing to build full version executables for those who do not own full versions. This is a company loss waiting to happen...please don't just overlook this problem. If you have only 1 version of the software, then you eliminate this problem, the only thing they "might" be able to do is use earlier versions and have to convert up (which will eventually become incompatible, they'll have no choice but to purchase).

Edited by sabriath, 31 March 2011 - 11:10 AM.

[paul23]

IF you're going to make free version not give executables (which I am neutral against) then also dont compile the free-version gmks on the site (so don't share it). Because if you do you're (in my eyes) taking advantage of the monopoly you have with gamemaker's interpreter!

btw for all options: add some kind of choice. A choice often makes people happy (even if it's silly, like being able to choose whether you show the add BEFORE or AFTER the game played)

Edited by paul23, 31 March 2011 - 11:17 AM.