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#51 IQbrew

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Posted 01 March 2011 - 12:09 PM

Whether or not an element in a game is a glitch or made by design has really no bearing whatsoever on how fun that element makes the game. In Tribal, a glitch was discovered where you could keep jumping in a downwards hill in order to achieve insane speeds. Rather than 'fix' this bug, the developers kept it in the game after hearing how the fans enjoyed it. I believe it's been an integral part of the game ever since.

I've heard about glitches becoming features. I think they're called "Ascended Glitches". There's a big difference between being able to jam you gun into a wall and shoot past it and gaining insane speeds by running down a hill, though.

I'll grant that this particular one isn't as interesting as any of those. No particular skill is required to pull it off, but it is semi-hidden and context-sensitive, making it just one more move in the player's répertoire.

Similarly, I'll often get killed by bullets that passes through cover. Enemies often fall into cover too, making them impossible to hit and annoyingly pop up just to shoot me and go back into the floor. :lol:

I'm 100% with you here. I don't care how good a cutscene is; unskippability kills replay value and forces players to go through a non-interactive section you can't possibly guarantee they'll like. Even with books, consumers have been able to flip ahead of sections they've found boring.

The gameplay-story ratio is way off, and as I've said the dialog isn't interesting or fun to read. Unskippable cutscenes ruined this game from the start, I'm surprised that very few people had a problem with it.

Make it your goal to make IQbrew shut up by creating a game even he can't say bad stuff about.

Actually, she just achieved that by blocking me. Ah well, she's missing out on some good stuff.

Sorry I'll go back to my closet :medieval: <3

I don't know how to interpret that.

EDIT: My favorite game genre ever "Devil May Cry" was originally going to be a resident evil gme but they found a glitch that makes it possible to "juggle" enemies in the air, and therfor used it to create a completely different game

Edited Reply to EDIT:
I've heard that story. I didn't know it was true, though.

Edited by IQbrew, 01 March 2011 - 12:10 PM.

"Personally, I rather look forward to a computer program winning the world chess championship. Humanity needs a lesson in humility. "

#52 hardlylike

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Posted 01 March 2011 - 12:44 PM

I don't know how to interpret that.

I just felt like ending rthe post with something random, I don't know why

Actually, she just achieved that by blocking me. Ah well, she's missing out on some good stuff.


if you start to give positive feedback or more detailed critique that she can use instead of just repeating that something is bad in every post without saying why it's so bad, she might change her opinion about you^^

The gameplay-story ratio is way off, and as I've said the dialog isn't interesting or fun to read. Unskippable cutscenes ruined this game from the start, I'm surprised that very few people had a problem with it.


why do you think it's off? I disagree there because I like the characters, how they have different personality, how they react differently, how they develop during the game and the story fits them IMO.
Why don't you think that the dialog is interesting? it's different dialog at different time and I can see that she put thoughts into it, what isn't fun about what part in the dialog and what do you think lacks?
I agree about cutscenes, the player should be able to skip if he/she wants to unless it's a very important part of the story.
I'm not surprised because I myself enjoyed it because I play rpg games mainly because of their story.


Edited Reply to EDIT:
I've heard that story. I didn't know it was true, though.


I love the dmc games so I've tried to find out if it's true, and many sites believe it's true so I think it's true

Edited by hardlylike, 01 March 2011 - 12:48 PM.

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#53 IQbrew

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Posted 01 March 2011 - 12:54 PM

Why don't you think that the dialog isn't interesting? it's different dialog at different time and I can see that she put thoughts into it, what isn't fun about what part in the dialog and what do you think lacks?

To put it simply, nothing said is ever more clever or interesting than talking about "Tooth cells" or "Coffee". The text scrolls so slowly. And, as I've said, it's all unskippable. Some of my favorite games (Such as Phoenix Wright or 999) are text based, but this game's story simply does not merit the amount of time spent listening to conversations.

I'm sorry, but I can't explain it more clearly than this. I hope you understand.
"Personally, I rather look forward to a computer program winning the world chess championship. Humanity needs a lesson in humility. "

#54 Yal

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Posted 01 March 2011 - 01:15 PM

Actually, she just achieved that by blocking me. Ah well, she's missing out on some good stuff.

I'm doing neither. First of all, Hardylike quotes you, so I'm not missing out on anything; secondly, it's no good stuff.

if you start to give positive feedback or more detailed critique that she can use instead of just repeating that something is bad in every post without saying why it's so bad, she might change her opinion about you^^

I doubt I'll do that. He's not my type. Perhaps I'll unblock him once he starts to come with useful critique. For instance. Say that I accept that the dialogue during the first 15 minutes of gameplay is bad. What would you like to have there instead? Sheesh. A member with "IQ" in his name should understand that this question is always implied when it comes to feedback; if I just remove things rather than replacing them with new things, I end up with an empty file.

Being able to shoot trough two tiles is a glitch; being able to shoot trough one tile by placing your weapon in front of it is not.


I love the dmc games so I've tried to find out if it's true, and many sites believe it's true so I think it's true

What you said was true, but it's not the whole story. I've read an interview with one of the key people behind DMC. Put simply, the developers kinda got bored on making a game that was just the same as their previous game (the first Resident Evil game). They also happened to have a very nice project coordinator who accepted more or less any ideas they suggested, even if they was a little bit off from the original Resident Evil concept. After some time, the game had become vastly different from the original concept, but what they had seemed fun enough to stay on its own. That's when they decided to make some sort of unique game and chuck all the RE stuff overboard.

And... they never told their boss. According to the interview, the first time he got word about the RE2 team making a completely new game was when they showed off the golden master, telling him something like, "Um, well, the game actually kinda ended up like this."



Um, back on topic. Since Zeddi and Hardylike agrees about it, I will add the ability to skip dialogue.

There's a big difference between being able to jam you gun into a wall and shoot past it and gaining insane speeds by running down a hill, though.

I will have in-game mentions about the glitch, thus ascending it.
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#55 Zeddy

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Posted 01 March 2011 - 01:28 PM

Actually, she just achieved that by blocking me. Ah well, she's missing out on some good stuff.

I'm doing neither. First of all, Hardylike quotes you, so I'm not missing out on anything;

Ah, I remember arguments from my childhood where we'd tell a third party "Tell X that I won't talk to him directly 'cause he's a jerk."

Good times.
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#56 hardlylike

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Posted 01 March 2011 - 02:37 PM

if you add a skip button to the cutscenes, don't forget to add info somewhere about what the player must do

so for example: if guy A said to player that player need to catch a rabbit and give it to guy B in a cutscene, but player doesn't watch the cutscene... there must be a way to know that player is supposed to catch a rabbit and give it to guy B.

Would be funny tho if the player is punished for skipping the cutscene "HAHAH you skipped the cutscene and now you don't know what to do ::lmao:: "....or not
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#57 Yal

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Posted 01 March 2011 - 03:26 PM

if you add a skip button to the cutscenes, don't forget to add info somewhere about what the player must do

Obviously I should tell the player what the button is.

My plan is: if you skip cutscenes, you will only skip dialogue, you will still see moving characters and stuff - none of the cutscenes are long enough to be very tedious, and those who are always offer you a save point afterwards. So you won't miss very vital stuff (such as characters falling into deep pits).

As well, if you miss something, you can always chat with the NPC you start off nearby after the cutscene ends. Often they say something important (ESPECIALLY Cain in the safepoint).

If you've still missed something because you've skipped a cutscene you'd never seen before, then I have no pity in thee.


When the file lc_clear exists and has proper binary data inside, evidence that the game has been cleared at least one, I planned to have a "Esc to skip" message show up as soon as any dialogue starts or something, so that players will be reminded of this and not get bothered with unskippable cutscenes on their second play-trough just because they skimmed the Primer. They might still miss stuff since some cutscenes change depending on plot tokens (saving Voice, for instance, makes her show up at some cutscenes and alter the events in them) but, heck, I don't care. They can just load their previous save or something if they care. The SKIP feature shalt be used solely to skip cutscenes you have seen. Misuse at own risk.

Edited by Yal, 01 March 2011 - 03:27 PM.

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#58 Zeddy

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Posted 01 March 2011 - 03:41 PM

Misuse at own risk.

I have this attitude when I add features too. For example, the save-file in RAD is stored in plain-text, so the user can set the volume, resolution, gravity and whatever else to whatever they please. It's not the designer's job to babysit the player or decide what they should like, after all.

Likewise, there's really no need to hold the player's hand objective-wise. Final Columbus' progress is usually linear enough that you really don't need to pay attention to the cutscenes anyway. Just explore places you haven't been and open stuff you're able to open. Not too different from playing Super Metroid.

I'll pre-emptively bug report this, just in case:

Esc to skip

Doesn't escape currently shut the entire game down? I would be extra annoyed if my skipping caused the game to close and have me have to skip it again.

Edited by zeddidragon, 01 March 2011 - 03:42 PM.

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#59 Captain Cook

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Posted 01 March 2011 - 10:19 PM

Esc only closes the game if it's set to.

That said, I'd recommend a different button.

About the inexperience with language: you type it a lot better than many people on the internet who claim English as their first language. </grammarnazi>

Edited by Captain Cook, 01 March 2011 - 10:24 PM.

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#60 Yal

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Posted 02 March 2011 - 09:12 AM

Doesn't escape currently shut the entire game down? I would be extra annoyed if my skipping caused the game to close and have me have to skip it again.

I'm glad that you care, but I had actually planned to let ESC open the syspause menu rather than letting P do it (and then turn off "Esc to quit" and "Treat window cross as Esc keypress"). I don't know what kind of alien keyboards the YYG staff are using, but P is one of the hardest keys to press without looking away from the screen in a game that uses ZXC for normal interaction. And looking away from the screen before you pause is less fun than looking away from the screen after you pause, 'specially when in a gauntlet.

So... put simply, I'll take care of that bug before it occurs. I'll also try to add a cooldown so that pressing Esc to skip a cutscene won't bring up the syspause screen right afterwards all the time. That'd be annoying too.

Question: should I re-allow the game to draw the normal Windows window around it, so that people may click the cross to close the game in case they want to do so quickly?

About the inexperience with language: you type it a lot better than many people on the internet who claim English as their first language

Hey, thanks! ^_^ But honestly, I've learned to spell via Firefox: it has built-in spell control. It won't accept words like "gameplay", "platformer" or "cutscene", though. Kinda annoying, but I know how to spell those already. Oh, and Firefox uses American english standard, so I can't type e.g. colour or endeavour but must use color and endeavor lest I want red lines in my editor <_<. Fun fact: I'm actually able to type without looking at the keyboard, provided I'm at a Qwerty one. I just need to look at the keyboard when I need to type a semicolon (or else I press the key half the time) - guess why I hate C++ and love GML? ;)

Anyway, glad we seem back on subject after the issue yesterday.

================================================

In 2.0, I've changed the title screen to something mildly stolen from Iji. Since I know that some of you (ahem) find my games too loud at default volume, I've gotten the idea to add an options screen.

What options would you like to change? As far as I can imagine, I think that sound volume and windowed/fullscreen default are must-haves; I would prefer not having to have customizable input since I use keyboard_check_direct() at times, but I think I could work it in if a lot of people dreams about using, say, UIK plus WASD instead of ZXC plus arrows.

But are there anything else that could be implemented? I'd like to have at least four options on the options screen.
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#61 Zeddy

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Posted 02 March 2011 - 12:08 PM

I'm glad that you care, but I've already thought of that, silly. I've also realized something vital about pause buttons.

This is good. I needn't have worried.

Question: should I re-allow the game to draw the normal Windows window around it, so that people may click the cross to close the game in case they want to do so quickly?

Hm. Well. There seems to be some people who find lack of border to be more "professional" or "aesthetically pleasing" and don't care for the ability to drag and resize the game window the way you want to. I don't really care either way, since I always play in full-screen and know how to press Alt+F4.

Hey, thanks! But honestly, I've learned to spell via Firefox.

Spelling is one thing. Firefox won't teach you grammar, which you've also got a decent handle on. I thought everyone who's used a computer for longer than a year could type without looking; I certainly know semicolons well enough that I often type them without even meaning to. I'll often use semicolons in place of periods and the like, especially after just having programmed. From the sound of it, though, our semicolons aren't on the same place in our keyboards.

What options would you like to change?

UIK? Either Swedish keyboards are more different from ours than I thought you have some weird fingers. (On my keyboard, K is underneath I, meaning I'd have to twist my right arm towards the right to use the K button). In any case, keyboard_check_direct doesn't conflict with remappable buttons at all. Not that I care, I map everything to my gamepad anyway; remapping won't be an issue for me until you introduce native gamepad support.

I requested this with Timesnake: volume for the music that's separate from sound effects, or a boolean option to turn music off entirely. I don't want it as bad in this game as I did with Timesnake, though.

Oh! How about an option for scaling? I'm not sure how much work it'd be to implement, but you can apparently make scaling more pixelated (and we I want this with low-rez 2D games) by doubling/tripling/quadrupling the viewport size without increasing the regular view size. It'd require some code for either manipulating all the rooms at once or a script you use instead of room_goto that'll change the view for the next room on the fly. Also, I think I've seen cases where it's been used before and broken tiling or something. Probably not worth attempting with a project that's gotten this big.
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#62 hardlylike

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Posted 02 March 2011 - 01:43 PM

K is under I here in Sweden as well:) but they are quite different

http://rozlozeni-kla...lavesnice-7.png

And I like games more if they still have the border
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#63 Yal

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Posted 02 March 2011 - 01:59 PM

UIK? Either Swedish keyboards are more different from ours than I thought you have some weird fingers. (On my keyboard, K is underneath I, meaning I'd have to twist my right arm towards the right to use the K button). In any case, keyboard_check_direct doesn't conflict with remappable buttons at all. Not that I care, I map everything to my gamepad anyway; remapping won't be an issue for me until you introduce native gamepad support.

I requested this with Timesnake: volume for the music that's separate from sound effects, or a boolean option to turn music off entirely. I don't want it as bad in this game as I did with Timesnake, though.

Oh! How about an option for scaling? I'm not sure how much work it'd be to implement, but you can apparently make scaling more pixelated (and we I want this with low-rez 2D games) by doubling/tripling/quadrupling the viewport size without increasing the regular view size. It'd require some code for either manipulating all the rooms at once or a script you use instead of room_goto that'll change the view for the next room on the fly. Also, I think I've seen cases where it's been used before and broken tiling or something. Probably not worth attempting with a project that's gotten this big.


As for UIK... You're right, it's seriously uncomfy to keep one finger on each of them. I just typed three keys near each other; K is below I on my keyboard too. (I'm on an QWERTY board with a few additional keys for the Swedish letters , , and - those are placed to the right of P ( is there) and to the right of L ( and are there, in that order). But I'm pretty 100% that the special characters triggered by Shift-digit, AltGr-digit, and non-letteralpha keys are different on my keyboard than yours... for instance my keyboard has mapped to AltGr-E, whilst I assume that American keyboard makers haven't even noticed that there's a new currency available in Europe).

Erm, /rant.

But my point was actually "If you have weird fingers, you should be able to setup controls that you like". Hence why I picked UIK instead of my first choice UIO.

As for separate BGM/SFX volumes: I think I could manage that - provided sound_volume() works like I want to... the experiments with Kirbyvania thought me a few things about lousy blah blah exponential growth, so likely it will this time. Especially if I make sliders instead of static options. The only problem might be cutscene sound_fade()s, but since nearly all of them fades OUT the sound, hopefully it won't be a huge problem.

As for changing the viewport: with Pro I'll be able to change any room setting (including all the view variables) on the fly, without being inside the room. So that'll be possible to do with a 5-line for loop (including the closing } which is on a separate line). No need to worry! ;) And thanks again, by the way.

The main problem is the 'tile break lines' that appear on some monitors once the viewport is not equal to the view (only when it's larger, I think - the monitors think that there should be space between the tiles or something; if one tile-pixel is bigger than one screen pixel, there might be screen-pixels without a tile-pixel assigned to them due to flop roundoff errors or something similiar techy), but if I just add a warning "NOTE: won't work correctly on all monitors - graphical distortion may be visible" that shows up as soon as the player sets it to anything beyond 1X, it'll be fine. I love the disclaimer. Best american invention since the cheeseburger. :)

It kinda reminds me of the salted peanut bags that reads "may contain traces of nuts". Wonderful.
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Open this spoiler for my games:

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#64 Zeddy

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Posted 02 March 2011 - 02:33 PM

Our keyboards are nearly identical; replace Ö and Ä with Ø and Æ and you've got the Norwegian layout.

I think I'd probably map the buttons to JIO if I were to use a keyboard, so the layout would be like on certain arcade machines. (Link is for a 177kB 1024x768 image) It makes more ergonomical sense if you think about it.

But I'm mainly replying because the tech nerd in me simply couldn't let this statement go by:

on some monitors

*shudder*

Replace 'monitor' with 'graphics card' and you'd be correct. The monitor only displays the image provided by the GPU and has nothing to do with tiling logic or any such thing.

Edit:

that'll be possible to do with a 5-line for loop

I can't believe I didn't think of that!

Edited by zeddidragon, 02 March 2011 - 02:37 PM.

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#65 Yal

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Posted 02 March 2011 - 03:16 PM

*shudder*

Replace 'monitor' with 'graphics card' and you'd be correct. The monitor only displays the image provided by the GPU and has nothing to do with tiling logic or any such thing.

Noted. I'm not a tech nerd, I'm just a general nerd. I've learned to disassemble computers, but not to put them back together. So whenever I find one in the block's recycle hut place, I run back home and get a screwdriver. Then I show the parts I could get loose to one of my friends next time he comes by so that he can identify them for me.

Oh, and we've sellotaped the fan of a scrapped air hockey table to the back of my computer now. It should make the PSU a bit (as in "a wee bit") healthier.

Oh, you live in Norway? I got the impression that you were from the USA, in particular after you said something like "It's less dangerous than playing football" when we discussed safety in soft-air gunfights before I learned how to code a good Shotgun in Gun Princess (and I assumed that you meant "American Football" since that's the most dangerous type of football, and since you called it just "football", then you'd be an american). Yes; I still remember posts from back then. I'm good at memorizing stuff. After all, I have no life. :)

Anyway, I'll remember that until next time.
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- The above is my personal opinion and in no way representative of Yoyogames or the GMC, except when explicitly stated -

 

Open this spoiler for my games:

Spoiler

Some useful game engines: (all completely free to use, even commercially, as long as you replace all included graphics / music first).
SisterEngine RPG Engine - - YaruFPS 3D Collision Engine -- YaruPlatEngine Platform Engine

New user? Can't draw but want to look unique? You can request a new avatar in this thread!


#66 Captain Cook

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Posted 04 March 2011 - 03:32 AM

Well, if you could find some translators, language would be a nice choice.

But then, that could be quite a bit of work... not something I'd have for 2.0.

Also, this isn't really an option, but as someone mentioned:

Im really enjoying the game so far, though, I gotta say you havent learned many things about color schemes, contrast and pixelart in general since gun princess. The hub/dialogue/menu is also very unnatractive, use more contrasting tones man, the whole game seems bleached out for the most part. you still manage to pull up some great skyes backghrounds, too bad most of the game is spent indoors :P


I think the graphics in general could use a bit of an update. Some of the stuff, like menu boxes, could use maybe a gradient or something with the black and blue colors. Or maybe just a different style. Some of the character mugshots seem a bit sloppy (such as Cain's). It'd be nice to see at least some of the graphics polished before 2.0.
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#67 skunkchop

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Posted 04 March 2011 - 06:27 AM

This room is really weird.
MILD SPOILERS
Please explain this to me.
It is the room with the rat that says "Squeak?," just past the cloud area. Anyway, here's my theory.
Earlier I found a sign that said "TRIANGLE STAR PENTAGON PENTAGON TRIANGLE That is the key." There happen to be five locked rooms here. One for each shape, it matches.
The first triangle could refer to the room in which you find the lore "Triangle." The last triangle might refer to the room that you open with the watergun. Why? Because the watergun's bullets are triangle-shaped.
Now the other rooms... a room with a bunch of boxes... a room with a dusty corner... and something else.

Yal, can you explain this please?
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#68 BK-TN

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Posted 04 March 2011 - 07:10 AM

IQbrew reviewed your game :D


Edited by BK-TN, 04 March 2011 - 07:14 AM.

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#69 Desert Dog

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Posted 04 March 2011 - 08:43 AM

Spelling error in the controls and hints thing. trough should be through.

Haven't got very far, but nice game. The cutschene's/dialogue is a bit clunky, though. I don't mind reading them, but too much time seems to be spent 'waiting' for things. I dunno, it's hard to explain, but like I come out of the caravan, and I wait 2-3 seconds before some text pops up.
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#70 Zeddy

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Posted 04 March 2011 - 10:50 AM

IQbrew reviewed your game :D

No, he didn't; he's doing a terribly inept Let's Play of it.

My favourite part is the one where he complains that the AI for the basic rat is too easy and almost dies to them. The one where he can't do a basic jump to that second pot comes close, though.

Oh, and I agree with Desert Dog about your use of sleep(); they're a bit awkward-like. Maybe make them shorter? They should definitely be skippable with the skip-button, too.

I'll also throw in an agreement with Captain Cook: some of the graphics could use an overhaul. There are certain backgrounds that rubs me the wrong way. The one in the first cave is an eyesore, for example. I think the one in the subway irked me, too. Cain's portrait seems mostly okay to me, but his beard looks kind of weird.

Edited by zeddidragon, 04 March 2011 - 01:17 PM.

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#71 Captain Cook

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Posted 04 March 2011 - 09:44 PM

I demand a retsupurae of that video.
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#72 Yal

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Posted 05 March 2011 - 01:57 PM

I demand a retsupurae of that video.

I demand a retsupurae of that video, too.

I would've imagined IQbrew to have a more mature voice, though. More like a death metal guitarist than Peter Parker pre-spider.

Oh, and he's silent most of the time, too. He doesn't really start to comment on stuff until the ratbusting part. And then he stops again. There'd be a lot of space for the retsuplayers to comment on him, at least.

Oh, CC, by the way, I've sent you the MIDIs. Kinda forgot to PM you about it... have you checked your inbox?


I'll also throw in an agreement with Captain Cook: some of the graphics could use an overhaul. There are certain backgrounds that rubs me the wrong way. The one in the first cave is an eyesore, for example. I think the one in the subway irked me, too. Cain's portrait seems mostly okay to me, but his beard looks kind of weird.

OK, I'll work a bit with the graphics, too. I'm not completely satisfied with all of them, myself.

Oh, and I agree with Desert Dog about your use of sleep(); they're a bit awkward-like. Maybe make them shorter? They should definitely be skippable with the skip-button, too

.
I'll see what I can do.
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#73 skunkchop

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Posted 05 March 2011 - 11:41 PM

This room is really weird.
MILD SPOILERS
Please explain this to me.
It is the room with the rat that says "Squeak?," just past the cloud area. Anyway, here's my theory.
Earlier I found a sign that said "TRIANGLE STAR PENTAGON PENTAGON TRIANGLE That is the key." There happen to be five locked rooms here. One for each shape, it matches.
The first triangle could refer to the room in which you find the lore "Triangle." The last triangle might refer to the room that you open with the watergun. Why? Because the watergun's bullets are triangle-shaped.
Now the other rooms... a room with a bunch of boxes... a room with a dusty corner... and something else.

Yal, can you explain this please?


Still stuck. Help?
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#74 Desert Dog

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Posted 06 March 2011 - 03:07 AM

image.


I'm stuck. I have a feeling I'm not meant to go down into the plumbing yet...
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#75 Captain Cook

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Posted 06 March 2011 - 05:05 AM

He claims it's not serious.

I'm not really sure if all of his comments here are, though (if they're a joke, they're not very funny).
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#76 Zeddy

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Posted 06 March 2011 - 10:35 AM

I'm stuck. I have a feeling I'm not meant to go down into the plumbing yet...

I don't immediately recognize the area. Could I have some context? Where are you, story-wise?
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#77 IQbrew

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Posted 06 March 2011 - 12:22 PM

He claims it's not serious.

I'm not really sure if all of his comments here are, though (if they're a joke, they're not very funny).

The video wasn't serious, although I was serious about the dialog. It needs to be fixed either by having less, more interesting, or just a button to skip it all.
"Personally, I rather look forward to a computer program winning the world chess championship. Humanity needs a lesson in humility. "

#78 Simaster48

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Posted 06 March 2011 - 07:44 PM

@Desert Dog: Well, at least not that part of it. suppose you used the damage jump trick to get there, eh ;)
Spoiler


@Skunkchop: Oh, i had almost forgotten that old signpost...
Don't quite remember what it was for, although i know it wasn't important in order to progress.

Edited by Simaster48, 07 March 2011 - 06:22 AM.

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#79 Desert Dog

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Posted 06 March 2011 - 08:57 PM


I'm stuck. I have a feeling I'm not meant to go down into the plumbing yet...

I don't immediately recognize the area. Could I have some context? Where are you, story-wise?

I don't know. I have about 7% lore, and 3 guns (oil gun, golden key gun, and normal gun)

I admit, I went kinda hay-wire exploring. I was falling down the plumbing, it warned me that perhaps I shouldn't, but I didn't think that I'd actually get stuck... Went down to some firey places, and yep, did that damage trick jump to get over some high places.

This is why games like this usually have the ability to jump between different save points which you've visited. :P
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#80 skunkchop

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Posted 06 March 2011 - 11:25 PM

Desert Dog: I kind of recognize that area. You're not trapped, are you? Can't you get out by going through the door? If your problem is that you can't go any FURTHER, then simply get out and look for another place to progress the story. You can come back later.

Simaster: No spoiler alert? I feel that discovering that ability is a pretty big turning point in the story.

And yeah, I know that where I'm stuck is not necessary to keep going. However, I really feel like I'm beside a puzzle, and I don't want to skip it.
Whenever you see this, please help, Yal. What is TRIANGLE STAR PENTAGON PENTAGON TRIANGLE?
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#81 Desert Dog

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Posted 07 March 2011 - 01:16 AM

Going through the door, and I'm in a pit.. I have to do a jump which I clearly need some sort of jump upgrade with.

There is an enemy bird there, so if I use the little birds for trick-jumping, then I should get over. However, my health is virtually nil (sad, I know, that I saved while nearly dead!) so I'm going to have to spend a lot of time killing little birds, and trying to replenish my health enough to make that perilous journey back.
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#82 skunkchop

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Posted 08 March 2011 - 12:55 AM

OH MY GOD! How could I not have seen this? LOOK AT THE FIRST POST ON THE SECOND PAGE!
THAT IS WHERE YOU ARE. I had the exact same problem. Yeah, the way I escaped is I used a bird to trick-jump out.

Wow! So you also managed to do the ultra-precise jump from the dent in the wall to get there! I thought I was the only one...
Anyway, I hope you can survive at least ONE hit from a bird. If you can, you can escape. If not, your best bet would be to ask Yal to update the game with a fix, which is what I tried before figuring out about the trick-jump.

Actually, there is something else you can do. It might take a bit of time, but it should certainly get you out...
1. Try getting birds to get over the wall. Any bird that gets over, kill it and take the blood it drops. Save very often to keep the health you acquired.
2. Soon enough, you will have enough health to escape. Trick-jump out.
3. Run!

EDIT: I just found out that you already thought of that. Disregard my advice then. Good luck.
And Yal, still waiting for an answer. :D

Edited by skunkchop, 08 March 2011 - 12:58 AM.

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#83 Desert Dog

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Posted 08 March 2011 - 06:07 AM

Haha, funny, yes I see we are(where!) stuck at the same place. :D

Unfortunately, I'm at 082 health which isn't really very much at all. :( I'll have to collect a LOT of blood, hehe.
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#84 Yal

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Posted 08 March 2011 - 08:06 AM

Haha, funny, yes I see we are(where!) stuck at the same place. :D

Unfortunately, I'm at 082 health which isn't really very much at all. :( I'll have to collect a LOT of blood, hehe.

If you have proper defence, you should be able to take a hit from them as soon as you get over 1.60 hp. So half job done! Since on Intended blood restores 0.03 hp, you just need to collect around 30 drops of blood. Birds drop 5 when they die, so if you can collect every single drop you just need to kill 6 birds.

I've added a few blocks in the GMK file, making it possible to get out without damage-jumping, but there's still a lot of things I want to do before uploading the 1.2.0 (aka version 2.0 - I've renamed it to avoid confusing it with a sequel).

Question: should I upload the fixed and regraphiced game now and then have the new plot branches and time-consuming-to-add stuff in a later upload?

Whenever you see this, please help, Yal. What is TRIANGLE STAR PENTAGON PENTAGON TRIANGLE?

It's a secret code :P. OK, to answer seriously: you're at the wrong place. There's no connection with the Fairy Pistol (although that was a very good idea!) in the puzzle. In fact, I was boring enough to have switches with symbols in the background above them. When you spot them, you'll understand. And they're hidden kinda well. Have you found the...
Spoiler



Oh, and as for the intro chitchat - I have a dream plan about how to make it better. In fact, I've planned to add in-game sarcastic remarks to every single thing IQBrew says in the video (that won't take long :P)
To give a short resum: perspective changes to Wither, Teal and Smith just as they prepare to go away. The player will control Emily, have a Revolver, a Foam Shell and a Gatling Turret, and face off monsters they won't face "for real" until 30~50 minutes later. Then the chitchat will occur, with better text and big sprites just like in Mario's flashback nightmare.
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#85 Desert Dog

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Posted 08 March 2011 - 09:43 AM

The more I play this game, the more I marvel. This game is a diamond in the rough.

I have a lot of little personal gripes with the game, which take a hit at the game, funwise. As I said before, the textboxes (code) seem clunky, and there ARE long bouts of tedious dialogue.

Also, I'm finding it hard to connect with the players, at least at first.. I'm starting to, kinda, now, but it was very much at the start 'oh, some random guy likes coffee' 'whats-his-face, cain, he's kinda funny'. 'the blue kid doesn't say much...'

I'm starting to get interested, and I'm curious about that little red headed doctor kid, and finding out a little more about her/him. after the mouse epiosode, she/he seemed pretty emotional. Also Cain is starting to work on topping his cool-o-meter up.

I almost always have no idea where I'm meant to go.. sorry, that guys maps don't help me! It involves me blundering around rooms, shooting monsters until I get to a dead-end, and then I backtrack and try another room. This wouldn't be sooo bad, in fact it's pretty fun dungeon exploring if it wasn't for..

..It's dang hard! I guess I should have hit casual mode, but the levels are packed with enemies, and I have to fight tooth and nail to get anywhere. I'm an experienced platformer, and I find it difficult.

Enemies are kinda buggy, I mean,I don't mind stupid enemies, but it's weird to have birds/mice leap straight into the middle of a wall. Considering the rest of the game, it should be no problem for you to pop them out.

It may be worth nothing the physics are a bit slidey. They work for the game, and as a cave story player, I can work them fine, but I can see people getting put off. They jump, slide off, jump again, slide off.. heck, lets play something else. I imagine you know by now, but your going to lose players who just don't like this!

Last gripe... I think the main characters sprite is kinda ugly. I know, sorry. I think Cain looks cool, and the others are o.k. but for some reason I just think this guy looks like an octopus. His portrair looks o.k, though.

The last negative for me, is that a game like this is rated only 3.8 on YYG's, where as games like my own Prison Ball manage 4.3. Easily the ratings should be reversed, however, the initial 'roughness' of the game is clearly losing you points with players. You got a 5/5 from me, great design, the amount of work put into this game is blowing my mind, and in that respect reminds me very much of other classy solo efforts like Iji, An Untitled Story, and Cave Story.
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#86 Yal

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Posted 08 March 2011 - 10:14 AM

*Lots of useful things*

Thank you! I've noted down all of your personal gripes and I'll try to fix them:

> Rewrite rat code from scratch (it's one of the first things I coded in the game, right after taking the decision to use tiles for collisions to speed the game up)

> Increase friction even more

> Better connection with characters early (Tallie's emotional side is underdevelopped - thanks for mentioning this, I'll work something in).

> Mario's sprite "looks like an octopus" - Hmm... This public computer I'm on right now has a really bright and saturated screen, and on that I see what you're talking about. I don't know if I have weird screen settings on my computer at home or if it is this computer that is the anomaly, but part of redrawing the tileset was changing colors in it to more saturated and strong shades - someone commented on the game "being too bleak", and since more or less anything was nigh-grayscale I saw my chance to strike at that problem.

Anyway, I'll work a bit with Mario's sprite. The white parts of his eyes bothers even me, and even though nobody (spare Simaster) has noted that his portrait pictures him with a green scarf and his sprite with a red, it has also been a minor annoyance (thus forgotten each time I want to change anything) of mine. I'll see what I can do with it.


Oh, and I've redrawn Tallie's face sprites. Apparently I needed to since you couldn't see that she was female. I will also redraw Jack's face images. Both of those mugshots are... they don't really look good, but it's hard to put a finger on the problem.



And as stated above, the intro has high priority to be improved. The early parts of the game are pretty bad. As always, it takes some time before you "hit it" and things get good.

Oh, and the misspelling in the How To Play has been removed - I've made something totally different (multi-page screen with animated effects) for that part.

As I said before, the textboxes (code) seem clunky,

Could you explain that a bit better? A seemingly piece of clunkiness is pretty hard to code away.
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#87 Simaster48

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Posted 08 March 2011 - 10:21 AM

Quote

As I said before, the textboxes (code) seem clunky,

Could you explain that a bit better? A seemingly piece of clunkiness is pretty hard to code away.


My guess is that this is a new visual bug, i bet there is a problem with the font!
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#88 Venomous

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Posted 08 March 2011 - 06:53 PM

Amazing game. I gave it a 5 on YoYo.
It would look nice if you'd make a custom loading bar and icon.
I also think you should make the friction higher. I find it very hard to reach some spots because I keep sliding off.
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#89 Desert Dog

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Posted 08 March 2011 - 09:46 PM

Oh, and I've redrawn Tallie's face sprites. Apparently I needed to since you couldn't see that she was female. I will also redraw Jack's face images. Both of those mugshots are... they don't really look good, but it's hard to put a finger on the problem.

I was pretty sure she was a girl, but she was meant to be young.. which made me wonder if she was a boy. :P

Could you explain that a bit better? A seemingly piece of clunkiness is pretty hard to code away.

I'm just running round now, and talking to characters, and the textboxes are fine. So simple talk-dialogue is o.k. (btw, do I HAVE to stand in front of a character to talk to them? Why not when I'm right on-top of them? You could do what cave story had, and give him a little 'hop-back')

It must be the cutscene's. zeddi mentioned overuse of sleep() and I suspect that that is it... this is kinda how the dialogue plays out.
talk talk talk
pause
talk talk
pause (player sprite turns around maybe, or drinks coffee)
talk talk.
pause
talk talk talk talk talk
pause

And some of the conversations are quite long, so you perhaps see where I find this tedious. And thinking of it, I think a part of it is that lack of 'emotional' connection with these characters. I can imagine you watching it, you designed it after all. Your imaging Coffee as he's swigging that coffee, and your imagining that expression on that glasses girls' face as she turns away when talking about her kid.
I didn't write the story, I'm just starting in it. The only 2 ways I can connect with these characters is through their
1: Portraits:
2: The story.

And thinking more of, the portraits aren't doing it, they aren't conveying enough to me. I'm having to rely on the story.

I think to be fair, that in the respect that it is in-game dialogue that it isn't too bad. I've tried to think of other RPG games, and their dialogue, and they RARELY have long dialogue in an in-game form.

I.e. think of Iji's cutschene's. The in-game ones were uuusually short, and there were no pauses, and events that happened in it happened quickly.(faster than me having to watch your character drink coffee!)
The other cutschene's were more cinematic.

And as stated above, the intro has high priority to be improved. The early parts of the game are pretty bad. As always, it takes some time before you "hit it" and things get good.

Yeah, I think I forgot to mention it, but I seem to recall there was no music in the intro, or at least, for a good part of it. Not good!
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#90 Yal

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Posted 09 March 2011 - 08:06 AM

I think to be fair, that in the respect that it is in-game dialogue that it isn't too bad. I've tried to think of other RPG games, and their dialogue, and they RARELY have long dialogue in an in-game form.

I.e. think of Iji's cutschene's. The in-game ones were uuusually short, and there were no pauses, and events that happened in it happened quickly.(faster than me having to watch your character drink coffee!)
The other cutschene's were more cinematic.

This might sound pathetic... but if I replaced the long dialogue parts with scenes with 'big sprites' (like the flashback nightmare)? Would that be better? They'd of course have animations and stuff to make it more vivid.

A full list of scenes I'm 100% sure I will replace this way:
Spoiler


I'm not very good at cinematic stuff, I'm afraid... Plus, I tried to start the game plot with mission things going on routine, it takes a while before things go wrong (water tower). And when everything goes as planned, there's often pretty few quick events. Perhaps this was a bad design decision... *sigh*


Yeah, I think I forgot to mention it, but I seem to recall there was no music in the intro, or at least, for a good part of it. Not good!

Didn't things automatically get more emotional/serious with music turned off?

It must be the cutscene's. zeddi mentioned overuse of sleep() and I suspect that that is it... this is kinda how the dialogue plays out.
talk talk talk
pause
talk talk
pause (player sprite turns around maybe, or drinks coffee)
talk talk.
pause
talk talk talk talk talk
pause

Sigh. I'll do my best.
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Open this spoiler for my games:

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#91 Desert Dog

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Posted 09 March 2011 - 08:56 AM

Didn't things automatically get more emotional/serious with music turned off?

Not so I'd notice.

This might sound pathetic... but if I replaced the long dialogue parts with scenes with 'big sprites' (like the flashback nightmare)? Would that be better? They'd of course have animations and stuff to make it more vivid.


One of my favourite RPG's cutscene's have that style(or a similar style). :) Here's a sneak peak, if you like:
http://www.youtube.c...h?v=K2fj78EtRGo

Sigh. I'll do my best.

Sorry. I know I'm being mean&demanding an awful lot. :) I'm playing the part of a critique, and I don't expect you to implement every change, nor do I expect every analysis/idea I give to be correct, or the best for the game. I'm just one player, who'd giving his feedback... work it in with the feedback other players are giving you, and how you yourself feel.
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#92 Yal

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Posted 09 March 2011 - 11:51 AM

One of my favourite RPG's cutscene's have that style(or a similar style). :) Here's a sneak peak, if you like:

Ah. Also kinda reminds me of Snatcher (a text-based game with images) and comics. No, what I was thinking about would be having a close-up image of all characters (with each character having an individual sprite so that they could have animations (crying, drinking coffee)), perhaps drawn from some perspective. But having those extra panels popping up... I kinda like how that looks, too.

That's gonna be an awful lot of drawing work though... - -*

Anyway, what strikes me is the low amount of dialogue in that cutscene. I know that all 16-bit jRPGs are like that (due to kanji/hiragana/katakana characters saying a lot more in the same space), but still... very short and concise... but the text alone doesn't tell one very much about character personalities.

My games are pretty much the opposite: very little graphics, but the text tell you a lot.


Here's my current plan:

> Commit improvements to Final Columbus 1.2.0
- Fix weapon system to allow non-Mario characters to have unique weapons (Emily will have a Revolver, a Foam Shell and a Pocket Gatling Turret).
- Fix dialogue parts in the chitchat
- Perspective change to Emily, Teal and Smith
- Playable part when the group goes back. Smith brags a lot about his map making skills.
- Back to chitchat; talk about Daphne, Coffee arrives.
- Smith arrives. Improved talk during the briefing.

> Upload the game to YYG and replace all screenshots with new ones. Since the new intro is better and the physics are less slippery, people will rate the game higher.

> Start to work with Final Columbus 1.2.1, where I include those long-time things like more endings, more cutscenes and more plot branches.
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- The above is my personal opinion and in no way representative of Yoyogames or the GMC, except when explicitly stated -

 

Open this spoiler for my games:

Spoiler

Some useful game engines: (all completely free to use, even commercially, as long as you replace all included graphics / music first).
SisterEngine RPG Engine - - YaruFPS 3D Collision Engine -- YaruPlatEngine Platform Engine

New user? Can't draw but want to look unique? You can request a new avatar in this thread!


#93 Yal

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Posted 14 March 2011 - 01:30 PM

UPDATE!! Newest version is v1.2.0, replacing v1.1.2.

Full list of updates, straight from the file fc_updates:
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#94 Zeddy

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Posted 14 March 2011 - 03:01 PM

This post is going to be edited. A lot.

-Loading and title screens are really nice! There's a graphical anomoly with a couple of pixels at the scarf blowing, though.
-When entering the music player, sound is reverted back to 100%.
-Actually, the sound volumes just don't take effect in the game at all, only on the menu screen.

-After the rat-killing part, NOTHING HAPPENS. I repeat: The game locks up!

Edited by zeddidragon, 14 March 2011 - 03:13 PM.

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#95 Yal

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Posted 14 March 2011 - 03:27 PM

-When entering the music player, sound is reverted back to 100%.
-Actually, the sound volumes just don't take effect in the game at all, only on the menu screen.


Aww...

-After the rat-killing part, NOTHING HAPPENS. I repeat: The game locks up!

WHAT???

Someone else has reported this at the YYG, which made me try the game out, and it worked fine for me. Twice. I have no idea what causes the problem, but I'll give a shot at solving it nevertheless as soon as I get home.

Suggestion: load the game again (you can press ESC to skip cutscenes), and after killing the rats, face right and wait until the screen scrolls all the way to the maximum value, then go and hit the invisible marker that starts the conversation. If this helps, I know what the problem is.

*tries to face left at said place and see if it causes trouble*

Nothing abnormal happens! I can't cause the glitch to appear at all! -_____-

I've used the Anti-Decompiler, do you think that could be the cause of the problem?

EDIT: I'll upload the non-antied version. It misses some stuff from the antied version, but it's not that much. It has an uglier loading screen and the place where you get the Fairy Pistol upgrade is impossible to reach, and enemy placement in Emily's scene is a tad evil. But hopefully the game works anyway, so that the people keep down until I've made a fix.

Edited by Yal, 14 March 2011 - 03:31 PM.

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- The above is my personal opinion and in no way representative of Yoyogames or the GMC, except when explicitly stated -

 

Open this spoiler for my games:

Spoiler

Some useful game engines: (all completely free to use, even commercially, as long as you replace all included graphics / music first).
SisterEngine RPG Engine - - YaruFPS 3D Collision Engine -- YaruPlatEngine Platform Engine

New user? Can't draw but want to look unique? You can request a new avatar in this thread!


#96 Zeddy

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Posted 14 March 2011 - 03:32 PM

Worked fine this time.

The last time, I had entered the desert to the left after killing the rats. Maybe that was it?

Edit: Actually, when was the scene with Emily supposed to take place? Only change I noticed during the chitchat was that there was more chitchat.

Edited by zeddidragon, 14 March 2011 - 03:39 PM.

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#97 Yal

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Posted 14 March 2011 - 03:37 PM

Did you use the new version I just uploaded this time? If not, then the problem has to do with the desert. I'll look it up. Or - in the worst case - it's randomly caused.
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- The above is my personal opinion and in no way representative of Yoyogames or the GMC, except when explicitly stated -

 

Open this spoiler for my games:

Spoiler

Some useful game engines: (all completely free to use, even commercially, as long as you replace all included graphics / music first).
SisterEngine RPG Engine - - YaruFPS 3D Collision Engine -- YaruPlatEngine Platform Engine

New user? Can't draw but want to look unique? You can request a new avatar in this thread!


#98 Zeddy

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Posted 14 March 2011 - 03:40 PM

I'm still on the "old" version.
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#99 Yal

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Posted 14 March 2011 - 03:44 PM

Then the problem is likely either caused by exiting the room, or caused by some random event.

Well, I'll re-upload the newer version... 0_o
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- The above is my personal opinion and in no way representative of Yoyogames or the GMC, except when explicitly stated -

 

Open this spoiler for my games:

Spoiler

Some useful game engines: (all completely free to use, even commercially, as long as you replace all included graphics / music first).
SisterEngine RPG Engine - - YaruFPS 3D Collision Engine -- YaruPlatEngine Platform Engine

New user? Can't draw but want to look unique? You can request a new avatar in this thread!


#100 Yal

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Posted 14 March 2011 - 03:48 PM

I tried playing the newer version, going into the desert... but when I went back, the cutscene still worked as usual. I think it's caused by a random event. =_=
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- The above is my personal opinion and in no way representative of Yoyogames or the GMC, except when explicitly stated -

 

Open this spoiler for my games:

Spoiler

Some useful game engines: (all completely free to use, even commercially, as long as you replace all included graphics / music first).
SisterEngine RPG Engine - - YaruFPS 3D Collision Engine -- YaruPlatEngine Platform Engine

New user? Can't draw but want to look unique? You can request a new avatar in this thread!





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