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#1 Chronic

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 02:01 PM

Ok, so as some people know the Post Counts were shown when we went live a few days ago, but then were removed. We'll, they are now back and increment! (well... if i've changed the settings correctly)

Please do NOT abuse this by posting just for the sake of posting, we will take action if we find this is the case.

Oh, and there maybe more changes coming :)


Look! I have 1 post (at time of posting) now!
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#2 Wirodeu

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 02:13 PM

So it does only count posts that have been made after this feature was implented?
Any chance it will also show the amount of posts made before this feature was added?
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#3 Chronic

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 02:26 PM

Because of the way post counts are stored in the database, the only way to show everyones real post counts is by manually altering them. It can be done, but i doubt it will be.
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#4 Orc Leader

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 02:58 PM

Too bad you have to "start" over, but I sort of like the idea.
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#5 drazzke

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 03:01 PM

Too bad you have to "start" over, but I sort of like the idea.

Yeah, but, in my opinion, it is better then having no post count.

I have 1 post :)
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#6 tuntis

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 03:09 PM

eh, I'd have liken to see how many posts I had made during the years, but this is useless

Edited by Tuntis, 22 March 2008 - 03:10 PM.

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#7 Tarik

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 03:10 PM

Blah post counts are ridiculous. All they say is something about how much someone posts, which is no criteria for credibility or anything like that, nor is it an indicator of spamming.

That being said, it seemingly can't hurt either so this is cool.
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#8 A legend

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 03:11 PM

This is pretty sweet! Thanks, Chronic!
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#9 davidp

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 03:19 PM

Hm, how come post count has been brought back? Didn't mods (you amongst them) decide to turn it off, due to spamming and post count competitions? Like "I have xy posts, I'm great" kind of attitude and stuff.

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#10 tuntis

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 03:20 PM

Hm, how come post count has been brought back? Didn't mods (you amongst them) decide to turn it off, due to spamming and post count competitions? Like "I have xy posts, I'm great" kind of attitude and stuff.

David

They were never visible until this point.
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#11 edmunn

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 03:20 PM

Why does it restart from 0, instead of our actual post count?
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#12 GStick

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 03:21 PM

eh, I'd have liken to see how many posts I had made during the years, but this is useless


Me too, having been here so long it would've been neat to see.

But this could be nice too, just hope people are mature enough to avoid spamming just to raise their post count. Doubt that will happen though since there isn't really any benefit to it.
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#13 davidp

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 03:21 PM

@Tuntis: Or even so, yes. I remember we had discussions like this one before and why post counter was off.

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Edited by davidp222, 22 March 2008 - 03:25 PM.

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#14 Qwertyman

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 03:27 PM

You could go to "Find all member posts," count the number of posts on each page, and then count the number of pages. However, I don't know how far back the archive goes for some of the older users. I know pretty much all my posts are still there.
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#15 Chronic

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 03:28 PM

I've been informed that there is actually an option to rebuild post count stats in the Admin CP. Rebuilding them right now would be a bad idea as we are performing a rebuild of the posts table.

However, we might not rebuild them at all as we're looking in to post groups and what "rewards" people could be given through them.
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#16 Qwertyman

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 03:31 PM

However, we might not rebuild them at all as we're looking in to post groups and what "rewards" people could be given through them.

Wait - so there will be incentive to post? Or are you discussing whether or not to implement rewards?
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#17 Chronic

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 03:33 PM

Well, at the moment there is no discussion.. i just kind of mentioned it for other opinions from the staff members. I'm promising nothing right now.
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#18 Qwertyman

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 03:37 PM

Well just my two cents: if you were to implement a reward system, I feel that everyone's post count should be altered to reflect their actual post count. I've been here for a good three years, and a lot of members have been here for much longer than that. Starting over would kind of be a slap in the face to those that have been around for a while because they'd be in the same boat as someone who joined a week ago. I realize that it could take a lot of work on the admin side, but I think that would only be fair.

Edited by Qwertyman, 22 March 2008 - 04:28 PM.

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#19 A legend

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 03:57 PM

Well just my two cents: if you were to implement a reward system, I feel that everyone's post count should be altered to reflect their actual post count. I've been here for a good three years, and a lot of members have been here for much longer than that. Starting over would kind of be a slap in the face to those that have been around for a while, because they'd be in the same boat as someone who joined a week ago. I realize that it could take a lot of work on the admin side, but I think that would only be fair.

I think Qwertyman's right. I've been here for, I think more than 2 months, and I have more posts than my post count shows.
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#20 edmunn

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:05 PM

I think Qwertyman's right. I've been here for, I think more than 2 months, and I have more posts than my post count shows.

Same, but for two years! (I think =S)
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#21 Mark Overmars

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:12 PM

You can also argue the opposite. In the end it counts how helpful people are on the forum now. Not how helpful they were in the past. So letting everybody start at 0 will give everybody an "equal chance".

But remember what Chronic said. We will take action when people post spam to increase counts.

We are discussing a number of other changes and are step by step implementing them. For example, there is not a different favicon and we did slightly improve the YoYo Games logo. (No discussions about these please.)

And I hope everybody is happy with the current speed of the GMC. And when the database rebuilt is ready it might even become faster.

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#22 NAL

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:15 PM

Been here since 2005 but I've not posted much. :)

I don't like post counts - no matter how much you reiterate that people posting for the hell of it will be punished, people will always post more and more (maybe with half-relevant content, but usually pointless) posts just to add to their post count... which in turn YYFises the forum.

Still, that's my opinion. I'll just go with the flow :)

Edited by Notalot, 22 March 2008 - 04:16 PM.

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#23 A legend

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:16 PM

Ya know, Mark's right, too! I wonder which would be better... Past post counts, or present post counts. I'm just not sure...

Edited by A legend, 22 March 2008 - 04:17 PM.

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#24 Orc Leader

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:23 PM

I like the equal chance part Mark said.
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#25 A legend

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:25 PM

If a person has created a great idea, the person can create another one, I say!
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#26 Mordi

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:25 PM

I understand that you, Chronic, won't want to have to manually change the post count for every member of the forum, but the feature is just useless without it. Heck, maybe its pretty useless anyway? I noticed on the YoYo forums that there way, way too much spam there, and by the end of the first week of the forum's lifetime, there were users with more than a thousand posts!
Well, its not useless... Kinda neat to know just how many posts youve written over the years. :) I wish there was a way to just show it to the user and not to the public, though. That would be nice (e.g. only you know your post count).
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#27 flexaplex

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:26 PM

Ya know, Mark's right, too! I wonder which would be better... Past post counts, or present post counts. I'm just not sure...

I don't think it's right.

You can also argue the opposite. In the end it counts how helpful people are on the forum now. Not how helpful they were in the past. So letting everybody start at 0 will give everybody an "equal chance".

But remember what Chronic said. We will take action when people post spam to increase counts.

We are discussing a number of other changes and are step by step implementing them. For example, there is not a different favicon and we did slightly improve the YoYo Games logo. (No discussions about these please.)

And I hope everybody is happy with the current speed of the GMC. And when the database rebuilt is ready it might even become faster.

Mark

There will be new people in the future and then they will be at a 'disadvantage' to the people that are starting now.. but you can't just keep resetting the post counts so it's fair. Also you use the words 'fair chance' which makes it sound like a competition or something, which is what this will turn into with some people.. there are plenty of ways of sneakily increasing your post count without the moderators being able to proove / knowing you are doing so.. and the majority of these posts will be non-benefitial for anyone.

I'm not really fond of the post count idea really. People that make a contribution to the forum will do so because they enjoy helping / making games, they have done to this point.. there is no need for rewards, all it's going to cause is extra unnecessary hassle.

Edited by flexaplex, 22 March 2008 - 04:38 PM.

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#28 Orc Leader

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:27 PM

I understand that you, Chronic, won't want to have to manually change the post count for every member of the forum, but the feature is just useless without it. Heck, maybe its pretty useless anyway? I noticed on the YoYo forums that there way, way too much spam there, and by the end of the first week of the forum's lifetime, there were users with more than a thousand posts!
Well, its not useless... Kinda neat to know just how many posts youve written over the years. :) I wish there was a way to just show it to the user and not to the public, though. That would be nice (e.g. only you know your post count).


I like that idea too.
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#29 A legend

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:29 PM

Well, maybe WE can help the administrators of these forums get rid of those ways to hack into your post count!
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#30 Zezuken

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:29 PM

So the post count is back, not sure how helpful this will be, but it would show how involved people are in the community.
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#31 Qwertyman

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:30 PM

Perhaps a karma system would be more useful? If we are judging by helpfulness, a karma system might be a better indicator than post count. I don't know how feasible this is with the current IPB software.

Edited by Qwertyman, 22 March 2008 - 04:31 PM.

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#32 pythonpoole

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:31 PM

I can't say for certain if enabling the post count is a good or bad thing. I do think it will definitely lead to people judging others by how much posts they've made and use that to tell how much 'experience' or 'knowledge' they have about Game Maker, when in fact someone with hundreds of posts could be very novice in skill, and someone with no posts could have just been observing and actually have a very advanced skill. Also I do think it will lead to competition, naturally humans all instinctively want to compete (and win) against others... now it will mean there are more contributions to the forum, but whether these are quality contributions.. I don't know.
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#33 A legend

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:33 PM

I can't say for certain if enabling the post count is a good or bad thing. I do think it will definitely lead to people judging others by how much posts they've made and use that to tell how much 'experience' or 'knowledge' they have about Game Maker, when in fact someone with hundreds of posts could be very novice in skill, and someone with no posts could have just been observing and actually have a very advanced skill. Also I do think it will lead to competition, naturally humans all instinctively want to compete (and win) against others... now it will mean there are more contributions to the forum, but whether these are quality contributions.. I don't know.

Now, THAT'S what I call a post, python!
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#34 flexaplex

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:36 PM

I can't say for certain if enabling the post count is a good or bad thing. I do think it will definitely lead to people judging others by how much posts they've made and use that to tell how much 'experience' or 'knowledge' they have about Game Maker, when in fact someone with hundreds of posts could be very novice in skill, and someone with no posts could have just been observing and actually have a very advanced skill. Also I do think it will lead to competition, naturally humans all instinctively want to compete (and win) against others... now it will mean there are more contributions to the forum, but whether these are quality contributions.. I don't know.

Yes, what can you really tell from a post count? Just how much someone's posted.. that's not a basis to reward someone or to judge them. You can get nearly as much information by just looking when they've joined to forum.

Edited by flexaplex, 22 March 2008 - 04:40 PM.

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#35 pythonpoole

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:38 PM

It's not that you can't judge them that way, it's that you shouldn't.. people will do it anyway, just like they judge a book by it's cover, a movie by it's trailer, or a product by it's tv commercial.
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#36 A legend

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:39 PM

Actually, I thought of saying something like that.
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#37 jimmyjames

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:43 PM

It's not necessarily a bad thing, it is just the way people handle it. The only way it should be a problem is if people start running around saying, "l337 pwnage mi pst cnt pwns urs ftw111111111 o adn bi tEh wAy.................. l337."

I also think a karma system(like what is implemented in the GMC extension) would be more beneficial.
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#38 NAL

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:45 PM

Adding to my last post, I think the Joined: ... date speaks much louder than a post count would. Having 150 posts with Joined: Yesterday written underneath would just make you look stupid...
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#39 Eyas

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:47 PM

I don't understand.. IPB can easily recount postcounts for all members.. just go to Tools & Settings -> Maintenance -> Recount & Rebuild, scroll to "Rebuild User Post Counts" and start the script.

While I see Mark's point, I like to look at postcounts as some sort of a measure of a user's 'pristiege' -- not an accurate measure of course, but a 'measure' nevertheless. A postcount shoes the total effort a user has put into participating effectively in a community, and forgetting the past seems to be a sad thing to do -- especially since it is very much possible.

I know the GMC's database is humungous.. but running a one-time script for the better good of the community would be worth it.. wouldn't it?
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#40 A legend

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:47 PM

Ya mean like a spammer?
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#41 flexaplex

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:48 PM

It's not necessarily a bad thing, it is just the way people handle it. The only way it should be a problem is if people start running around saying, "l337 pwnage mi pst cnt pwns urs ftw111111111 o adn bi tEh wAy.................. l337."

I also think a karma system(like what is implemented in the GMC extension) would be more beneficial.

A karma system would be more benefitial.. however it more than likely not work on a forum like this.

And there are plenty of other ways to make useless posts that 'look legitimate' than just putting "l337 pwnage mi pst cnt pwns urs ftw111111111 o adn bi tEh wAy.................. l337." like going around the creation forum and putting something like "nice game 9/10" without even playing the game or going into to nocive q&a topic and putting something like "yes I agree with Ragarnak" without actually contributing anything.

Edited by flexaplex, 22 March 2008 - 04:49 PM.

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#42 SquareWheel

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:48 PM

The only advantage I can see in postcount is people will post help in Q&A to raise their postcount, but there is a very good chance this will spill out to elsewhere as well. Why not try it for now, and just see how it goes? Rebuilding the database is probably a good idea, is would probably discourage those with lower postcounts from spamming for higher post counts.

I would definitely forget the "Rewards" idea though.
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#43 A legend

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:52 PM

Yeah, GMCE provides a pretty stable karma system.
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#44 pythonpoole

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:53 PM

I don't understand.. IPB can easily recount postcounts for all members.. just go to Tools & Settings -> Maintenance -> Recount & Rebuild, scroll to "Rebuild User Post Counts" and start the script.

The GMC staff intentionally chose to reset everyone to zero if I'm not mistaken. This way, we all start on equal ground and then over time it will become obvious who posts more or less.
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#45 Erik Leppen

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:54 PM

One can see the approximate amount of posts by looking in your own profile and choose to search for this person's posts. However this uses the search feature so it would probably use a lot of server bandwidth. Anyhow, one could check it once and write down somewhere (signature?) what number of posts one made before this update.

Anyhow, I use the number of posts to see whether someone is very new here. People having 500+ posts know the rules, hence will much less probably do something that is not allowed here. A member can join two years ago and have three messages, which means he knows nothing about what can and can't be done here posting-wise, so the number of posts is a better indicator of how "long" a member has been here, where "long" should be read as a measure of total time of activity, not as "how long ago" one registered.

Anyhow, first post :)


Edit: one can approximate his post number right in the profile itself where it states the most active forum, where it states the number of posts and the percentage of the total. From this the total can be calculated :)

Edited by Erik Leppen, 22 March 2008 - 04:56 PM.

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#46 Mordi

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:55 PM

Ya mean like a spammer?

I consider the posts you are posting right now as spam. One liners, with no real information that would contribute to the topic. This is what I think many people will do (they'll want as many posts as possible). Especially the kids.
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#47 LeonWolf

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:56 PM

Cool, we have post counts now. :)
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#48 NakedPaulToast

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:59 PM

Post count\No post count: Don't care.
Start count today\Include all posts in database: Don't care.

I do know that there are a lot of posters who have posted an awful lot and said nothing, and some who have said a lot with very few posts.
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#49 A legend

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:59 PM

Dude, everybody knows that we now have post counts.
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#50 Coffee

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Posted 22 March 2008 - 04:59 PM

eh, I'd have liken to see how many posts I had made during the years, but this is useless


You currently as I now post have 1484 posts. :)

I like it, I just wish it was the correct number, oh well. Nice to have it again. :)
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