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The Unoriginal Games Problem


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#1 Fungames

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Posted 27 May 2007 - 09:45 PM

EDIT :
For those who want to sell their game.And want a internet page(s) and host for their game.I will try to help.Yes,I will Host you page,with you own domain transfer for $10.I bought a domain already with unlimited space so If you're interested,Pm me.
Also I'm posting this in the "Distributing Games" Topic.

Edited by Fungames, 28 May 2007 - 10:08 PM.

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#2 cbdman25

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Posted 27 May 2007 - 10:30 PM

jec_critic is right.

As much as I dislike seeing games of unoriginality the folks are doing it for their own enjoyment. It's a different story if they're working for a games company.

Oh, and as for leaving, you'll be back. They always return.
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#3 Burnt Waffle Productions

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Posted 27 May 2007 - 10:30 PM

I agree with jec critic. If you are going to say "Don't make fan games", then don't make a fan game yourself.
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#4 CoderBlue

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Posted 27 May 2007 - 10:48 PM

I dont post a lot either, but you have flame the forum so I'm going to respond.

Who are you to make such comments? Has your name been connected with major GM titles? Are you a top 10 programmer or anything on this forum?

Probably not. So here's some advice. Before you go insulting others, help them first if they ask for it. If that doesn't work, don't play the content. I think before you put down others, your work needs to be up to said standard
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#5 desolatorXT

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Posted 27 May 2007 - 10:53 PM

I agree with the topic starter.... The GMC is full of unoriginal games... I especially hate all these pokemon games...

but i don't agree 100%... and i don't see this as a reason to leave the gmc...

I think that all this unoriginality, is not only in gm, but in commercial games also...

The last original game created was Command & conquer 95, at 1995, since then we keep on playing clones of other games, with better graphics... So i don't see a reason to have a different situation here...

In addition to this, it is very, very difficult to find a team to help you to a project... It is impossible to do all the work of a game by yourself... I must be a spriter, a programmer, and a sound producer at the same time... And ok, i can design some primitive graphics, but i don't know anything about creating sounds... So its an one way road to steal/use sounds other people created...

Excepting these, many people have interesting ideas, for example i now have a very good idea of a game, with a scenario, etc... But how ,to do it alone? or with the other 2 people on my team? In order to create something like this we need at least 3-4 spriters, 2 music/sound composers, 5-6 programmers etc.... Where to find all these people??? Everyone here has his own ideas and ambitions, it is difficult to convince someone work under you...

That is why:

1) most of the games suck
2) we have clones...

If for example all these guys working on pokemon games, worked together, to create one, GM pokemon game, the results will be awesome...

I dont post a lot either, but you have flame the forum so I'm going to respond.

Who are you to make such comments? Has your name been connected with major GM titles? Are you a top 10 programmer or anything on this forum?

Probably not. So here's some advice. Before you go insulting others, help them first if they ask for it. If that doesn't work, don't play the content. I think before you put down others, your work needs to be up to said standard

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


No you are completely wrong... Fungames told some truths in his post... And i don't see what his work with GM, has to do with the topic.

Either he was the top Gm user, or he was a complete n00b, what he is saying is what matters. Not what he is.

Edited by desolatorXT, 27 May 2007 - 10:58 PM.

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#6 Jenner

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Posted 27 May 2007 - 11:06 PM

Stupid topic, since all your games are unoriginal too.
But then again; people do make too many clones and fangames.
Sometimes I fell like I and about 20 other people are the only ones who makes original games. I guess thats why I keep making them. Because I know im better then all the unoriginal people. The problem with those people will, however, become smaller now, since you and your Pokemon/Stickman-games leaves.
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#7 Sex Pistol

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Posted 27 May 2007 - 11:08 PM

I agree with the topic starter, its only the mods that seem to be making money selling there games, of coarse all the mods on this forum are members of a members only forum which i'm sure is known, but i don't see them going out of there way to help us newbies down here.... yeah they might bless us with bits of there wisdom but nothing that I would call going out of there way.

I'm wouldn't really be surprised if the only reasoned they help moderating this forum is to see what original ideas they can make there own seeing they know there way around the business side and a whole forum of mods will more likely make a game work,

kids will be kids when it comes to clones and stuff, so you can't expect to much from people just learning or making games with gm just for a little hobby.
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#8 roxas112492

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Posted 27 May 2007 - 11:09 PM

Make a original story for the game: check
Don't make clones : Check and i did lol
Don't use other peoples' sprites,backgrounds,music nor sounds: hardly, im a spriter
Explain your game you game well on the topic: true dat
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#9 desolatorXT

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Posted 27 May 2007 - 11:10 PM

Stupid topic, since all your games are unoriginal too.
But then again; people do make too many clones and fangames.
Sometimes I fell like I and about 20 other people are the only ones who makes original games. I guess thats why I keep making them. Because I know im better then all the unoriginal people. The problem with those people will, however, become smaller now, since you and your Pokemon/Stickman-games leaves.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


if you are answering to me:

1) i hate pokemon, and i never worked on a pokemon game
2) i didn't post even one game here, we are only developing a program now.
3) everyone believes that his game is original...
4) a person that stands out and says "i'm better than others" is definately worst than them or just at the same level as them or stupid.

Edited by desolatorXT, 27 May 2007 - 11:11 PM.

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#10 r1k

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Posted 27 May 2007 - 11:19 PM

I think people just need to start making games that they like and not care what other people think about them. There will always be people that will like certain games so just make what you like. Some people just make clones to get more attention, even if they dont even like what they are making. I remember this one topic were the guy was making a top down halo clone, even though he didnt own the game halo. Now maybe his friend had the game and he loved playing it, but it just seemed like he was using the halo name for attention.
I dont mind fan games, but if youre going to make them, make them good. Good games, including fan games, take time to make and if all fan games took enough time to be good, there wouldnt be so many fan games coming out everyday.
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#11 CoderBlue

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Posted 27 May 2007 - 11:33 PM

No you are completely wrong... Fungames told some truths in his post... And i don't see what his work with GM, has to do with the topic.

Either he was the top Gm user, or he was a complete n00b, what he is saying is what matters. Not what he is.


If someone came up to you on the street, and said "to be successful, you need to do this". What credentials do they have? Would you take 'life' advice from some random person off the street who could probably just be getting by paycheck to paycheck?

What about if Donald Trumph said it? Yea, see how personal bio makes a difference.

The point is, a random person came onto the forum whining about how he perceives 90 percent of the content here to be pure crap in his eyes, does he make any suggestions to make it better? Yes, but who is he to make those comments? Has he done anything great on the forums, or is he just part of the "norm" he is talking about.

edited: oh and my suggestion to help make less "crap" games is to promote team building, i dunno what the reason was it was taken down, but, it *would* help if there was a public place to help the process. garagegames has one

Edited by CoderBlue, 28 May 2007 - 12:08 AM.

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#12 Kidwarrior66

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Posted 28 May 2007 - 12:27 AM

That's because mods on steam (using the half-life and half-life two engines) are totally different from their sources. Look at the difference between Half Life and ESF (esforces.com). Do you know why they get attention? Because they're so different from the source. Two totally different 'games'. You can usually tell when an example's been ripped off in GM.

A completely original game is damn near impossible now. Sure, it was easy for Nintendo during the 1980's and early 90's because nothing like that had ever been done before. And now, twenty years later, it's harder to come up with something original. Let them make their clones. Bad games just disappear, you won't see them on WIP or Creations for more than a few weeks at most.
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#13 Alex

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Posted 28 May 2007 - 12:51 AM

You're not very patient...

You're forgetting that good games take a long time to make... especially for one person, and even more so for somebody who is 8-12 years old (which seems to be the average around here).
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#14 Kapser

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Posted 28 May 2007 - 12:57 AM

Some people wouldnt even start using game maker if it wasnt to make a fan-games, and it's not a bad thing. There is a lot of reason for making clones (no spriting skillz, giving respect to a game, having no ideas, need of good gameplay ect..) However, the only reason for playing it is if it is better than the original, or is tweaked. Most people who make mario clone just change sprites from the example, but would it really be better if it was an original game? It would probly basically be the same game with an ugly sprite. Anyways, everyone has to start somewhere. All you need is inspiration from things you like, just happen to often be mario.

I myself hate clones, and myself made clones but so did you. :huh:
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#15 pwhk

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Posted 28 May 2007 - 03:43 AM

Firstly, if you want to shout at others not making original games, please make your game more original. I admit that there were little original GM games at the GMC, but not none. (Click the one on my sig which with the controls you have never seen) Do some search and you will find original games. (Or got Staff's Choice -> Look for Bacteria 2. Magnets by jelleisgoed and Animats by _Daniel _at WIP are also original too.) But a big problem is that those original games tends not to have many replies, because most people are attracted to words like Pokemon. This discourage people to make original games then clones -> people make clones.

I personally hate clones, I would just play Pokemon made by the original maker, not anyone at the GMC.

Edited by pwhk, 28 May 2007 - 03:45 AM.

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#16 Gecko

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Posted 28 May 2007 - 05:21 AM

People will make whatever games they want, posts like this won't stop them.
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#17 hasser

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Posted 28 May 2007 - 01:35 PM

It's fine to make clones, but true that one shouldnt post them on the forums, almost everyone doing GM has changed the tutorials, fiddled with 1945, or some other form of copying. But even if people do post their garbage on the forums the just get bumped down.

Lets take a look at the WiP forum
slime online
worms (not a clone)
hang on to your ghoulies
tricked...

spam you DONT have to click on.... who is forcing you to play any clones?
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#18 captainjp

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Posted 28 May 2007 - 01:51 PM

Sometimes people make games to learn how to program their game properly well a clone game is the best way to learn the basic I guess.
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#19 gamshobny

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Posted 28 May 2007 - 06:04 PM

let me say that I agree with the reason this topic was created; there are no original games. I also agree that I, myself, am not making an original game.

However, who says that unoriginal games are bad? I still enjoy a good top-down shooter, a good platformer can still be fun, allthough it is not original.

As for the reason for this unoriginality; we are normal people. We just want to have fun and make a game, we don't want to spend hours and hours of thinking how a game should be, let alone dedicate a few years on developing them. But isn't that wat gamemaker was made for: to save people time?

Last but not least, do you think noobs who type liek dies will ever read something like this? I think not. I thereby think the best policy would be to ignore people who make typo's on purpose, help noobs who try to make a good game but fail uterly, cherish those who make a good game and declare everyone who actualy made an original gm-game god (all hail simon Donkers).
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#20 erthgy

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Posted 28 May 2007 - 06:14 PM

Stupid topic, since all your games are unoriginal too.
But then again; people do make too many clones and fangames.
Sometimes I fell like I and about 20 other people are the only ones who makes original games. I guess thats why I keep making them. Because I know im better then all the unoriginal people. The problem with those people will, however, become smaller now, since you and your Pokemon/Stickman-games leaves.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


hmm i wonder if i'd be under the 20 cause I did (at one point of time) make a minigames game. well, thats sorta original i mean, do you see any minigames game on the gmc? lettalone a popular one out in the public? but i do tihnk ripping crap offa other games makes everything suck. it's like:

pokemone clone?

nah.

zelda clone?

nah.

hey look, a new game, i should try it, i might likt the graphics, gameplay originality, so on and so forth.
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#21 erthgy

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Posted 28 May 2007 - 06:17 PM

Stupid topic, since all your games are unoriginal too.
But then again; people do make too many clones and fangames.
Sometimes I fell like I and about 20 other people are the only ones who makes original games. I guess thats why I keep making them. Because I know im better then all the unoriginal people. The problem with those people will, however, become smaller now, since you and your Pokemon/Stickman-games leaves.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


if you are answering to me:

1) i hate pokemon, and i never worked on a pokemon game
2) i didn't post even one game here, we are only developing a program now.
3) everyone believes that his game is original...
4) a person that stands out and says "i'm better than others" is definately worst than them or just at the same level as them or stupid.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

he was posting to the topic starter

( sry fer double post, ( i just like this topic )
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#22 mog13

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Posted 28 May 2007 - 06:38 PM

you know zelda and mario there super huge!!!! beginers will want there games to be liked and you know what? most people liked zelda or mario, its a nice easy starting platform and n00bs are exited they made a new version of there own games so shutup -.-"
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#23 BlaXun

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Posted 28 May 2007 - 06:44 PM

Yah, thats really the case.
Most people want to try out GM's possibilitys.
They want to get into MAKING a quick game but dont want to waste time with making sprites n such things.

So they take sprites from other games.
Of course tehy still want people to look at their creations...so...they take sprites from very well-known games...like mario, zelda , metroid...pokemon.

After they get bashed neough...and actually learned how everything works they'll try to be original.

Most people here that actually show their games make such simple things just to get some feedback.
But there are also those that make original games.

But, this isnt just a GM thing, even commercial games resemble many other commercial games.
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#24 manyquestions

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Posted 28 May 2007 - 06:58 PM

The last original game created was Command & conquer 95, at 1995, since then we keep on playing clones of other games, with better graphics...

You clearly don't play Nintendo games.


Well, fan games are okay if they're done well. I really don't have strong opinion one way or the other on this subject because there are enough original games out thee to keep me satisfied and if I don't want to playe a fan game I just don't play it.

And, to the topic starter, who wants GM on a PSP?
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#25 desolatorXT

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Posted 28 May 2007 - 07:31 PM

The last original game created was Command & conquer 95, at 1995, since then we keep on playing clones of other games, with better graphics...

You clearly don't play Nintendo games.


Well, fan games are okay if they're done well. I really don't have strong opinion one way or the other on this subject because there are enough original games out thee to keep me satisfied and if I don't want to playe a fan game I just don't play it.

And, to the topic starter, who wants GM on a PSP?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


Innovative/original games:

1) Pong
2) Super Mario 64 (forgot to tell about it)
3) Wolfenstein 3D
4) Ultima Online
5) The Legend of Zelda
6) Super Mario Brothers
7) The Sims
8) Body Harvest
9) Yie Air Kung-Fu
10) Dune 2 , the battle for Arrackis/Command & conquer 95

Everyother thing you see now, is a clone, or an idea, based on these games and/or their gameplay
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#26 manyquestions

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Posted 28 May 2007 - 08:16 PM

Innovative/original games:

1) Pong
2) Super Mario 64 (forgot to tell about it)
3) Wolfenstein 3D
4) Ultima Online
5) The Legend of Zelda
6) Super Mario Brothers
7) The Sims
8) Body Harvest
9) Yie Air Kung-Fu
10) Dune 2 , the battle for Arrackis/Command & conquer 95

Everyother thing you see now, is a clone, or an idea, based on these games and/or their gameplay


Come on! You're being overstrict about what's considered original. For one thing, every arcade game made before the NES was nearly 100% original and many on the NES too. But with your logic Pong is the only original game in the world because they're all video games which has been done before.
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#27 Fungames

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Posted 28 May 2007 - 08:52 PM

Stupid topic, since all your games are unoriginal too.
But then again; people do make too many clones and fangames.
Sometimes I fell like I and about 20 other people are the only ones who makes original games. I guess thats why I keep making them. Because I know im better then all the unoriginal people. The problem with those people will, however, become smaller now, since you and your Pokemon/Stickman-games leaves.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Pokemon game is dropped.The engine was originally developed from a former GMC member and he had sent the engine to me for perfection.He was new and he used a tutoiral so I gave it a shot.And I had no use from it what so ever.So engine left my mind.Stickman games?I wanted the game to look simple in a way for the physics to be spectacular.



Projects/Co-working
|3d Fps: Pure Action Ctf{update 08.03.07}||Unnamed Stick Platformer(Demo 4)||Pokemon MMORPG(PM me to beta test)|
|GMP(Game maker for the PSP)|



I hate to insult someone I don't know but seeing as you've flamed this forum I'll go ahaid.

Honestly, the games mentioned in your signature don't sound very original or interesting and the screenshots look shoddy too. A game involving stick men and a Pokemon rip off!? I've seen many of those before.

You might have more talent for programming than some of the Noobs but if those are the types of games that you make then they suck in terms of originality.

Apologies if I've misjudged you and chances are I'm wrong, but your post was not neccessary and actually, not everybody is serious about making games, they just do it as a small hobby so they do not devote their time to making them great. Either that or they are just very new to game making, so therefore they need more experience and help from others to get a lot better.

I think it's unfair to insult people like that.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You have the right of words.I understand that.And thats where I started noticing this problem.The USP was a project,The sprites where just for a simple view,It had no story to it,except the engine was for show.I was going to release the source but I didn't left the source to a friend.Also I didn't mean to affend anyone be saying noobs.I think that's dumb internet lingo.

let me say that I agree with the reason this topic was created; there are no original games. I also agree that I, myself, am not making an original game.

However, who says that unoriginal games are bad? I still enjoy a good top-down shooter, a good platformer can still be fun, allthough it is not original.

As for the reason for this unoriginality; we are normal people. We just want to have fun and make a game, we don't want to spend hours and hours of thinking how a game should be, let alone dedicate a few years on developing them. But isn't that wat gamemaker was made for: to save people time?

Last but not least, do you think noobs who type liek dies will ever read something like this? I think not. I thereby think the best policy would be to ignore people who make typo's on purpose, help noobs who try to make a good game but fail uterly, cherish those who make a good game and declare everyone who actualy made an original gm-game god (all hail simon Donkers).

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

A good platformer can be fun,probably if there's something we haven't seen before.To save people time?Yes,But I want to see a game great to hit store selves.The GM can manage Good graphics but with the right Anti-Lag engine.Great physics using Physic books from a book store.

Edited by Fungames, 28 May 2007 - 09:02 PM.

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#28 cbdman25

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Posted 28 May 2007 - 08:57 PM

Oh, and as for leaving, you'll be back. They always return.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


What's this? You return!
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#29 Fungames

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Posted 28 May 2007 - 09:02 PM

Oh, and as for leaving, you'll be back. They always return.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


What's this? You return!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes.Like I said,I merely help people now.
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#30 Sephiros_TH

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Posted 28 May 2007 - 09:15 PM

NEVER MIND

Edited by Sephiros_TH, 28 May 2007 - 09:18 PM.

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